Linque's Knockback Guide.

[dacidd]

Here's your answer:

http://linque.pp.fi/Pox/knockbackdirection.jpg

The picture displays which direction the Voil Bomber would move, if you attacked from one of the squares or cast avalanche centered on a square. It's not completely logical so I thought I'd make a screenshot showing exactly how it works.

Explanation:
If you have a cyclops eye belt on your champion, and attack the Voil Bomber on the picture, it is going to move two spaces to the direction of the black arrow in the square your champion is. For example, the squares right next to the Voil Bomber naturally point straight towards it, since if you attack it with a melee champion with a Cyclops Eye Belt on, it's going to move straight away from that champion.

Also, if you cast Avalanche centered on one of the squares on the picture, the Voil Bomber is going to move to the direction of the arrow on the center square of the avalanche.

The red arrow shows the direction the Voil Bomber would move if you cast Avalanche on top of the Voil Bomber.

The white lines are there just to further show the areas in which your unit / the avalanche needs to be centered to move the Voil Bomber in a certain direction.

A similar image about 2x2 units:

http://linque.pp.fi/Pox/knockback2x2.jpg


Two example cases:
http://linque.pp.fi/Pox/knockbackexample1.jpg

http://linque.pp.fi/Pox/knockbackexample2.jpg

*EDIT*
If any champ is to be knocked back into an object (I.E. another champ, impassible terrain such as walls, etc..) it will take damage equal
to 5 damage per space it is knocked back. An example would be: If you have knockback 2, and your opponent's champ is directly in
contact with a wall, or another champ it will take 5 damage for each space, so KB 2 would move you two spaces ~ 5*2=10+D (D= Initial damage dealt).
Remember though, you must knock back the opponent into the object, meaning you still need to follow the knockback guide to utilize this.
If there are any further questions let me know and I'll try to help.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

*Pull & Relocate Guide*

Could this be added to the original post?

Guide to Relocate & Pull

Here's the square priorities when pulling or relocating for the first two squares away from the puller/relocater:

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f169/dvs_sk8r/pr-small.jpg

When you relocate, one of the squares 1-4 must be available (not blocked). If all of those squares are blocked, you are unable to relocate. When relocating, the unit will automatically end up in the square with the highest priority, that is the square with the smallest number on that picture. 2x2 relocation is a bit more complicated, I might do some work on it later.

Pull works exactly with the same mechanics as Relocate, except it has a few extra rules. Here's the one-two-three of pull:

Any relocatable non-adjacent enemy unit within 7 spaces can be pulled.
The pulled unit can never end up further away from the puller than it originally was, but it can end up in a different space equally far as it were before the pull.
When pulled, the unit will go to the square with the highest priority that is not blocked (in the picture above, square number 1 has the highest priority with regards to the Voil Transporter in the picture. Second highest is square number 2, etc.)
A square is considered blocked if it is occupied with another unit or relic, it is impassable, a chasm or lava.
If the unit is unable to reach a square equally far away as the one it is residing in, you cannot pull the unit.
This is where it gets complicated: if the unit being pulled is already on the highest priority space available, it will still be able to be pulled, moving to the next highest priority square the pull can reach (that is, max 3 spaces away).

A few examples with the help of the picture above:
- A unit is standing on square 6 and the Voil Transporter pulls it. The unit will be moved to square 1.
- A unit is standing on square 11, but square 1 is blocked because there's a chasm there. The unit will be moved to square 2.
- A unit is standing on square 7, all squares adjacent to the transporter are blocked, the Voil Transporter pulls. The unit will end up in square 5.
- A unit is standing on square 5, all squares adjacent to the transporter are blocked, the Voil Transporter pulls. Because the unit itself blocks square 5, the smallest number square the unit can reach is square 7. Therefore the unit will end up in square 7.


NOTE:
I think there were some inconsistencies when I tested. For some reason, I think when I pulled from square 5 and only square 1 was blocked, the unit ended up in square 4 instead of square 2. Need to do further tests to figure it out.
__________________

[dacidd]

Bumping so it can be stickied...

[fireball94]

Bumping because knockback knowledge needs to be stickied more than silly Flyer tactics.

Or maybe I am trying to post farm? O.o

[Raileks]

its funny, that this is probably more important for playing SP than the guide to the faction.

[fireball94]

Honestly, that's the truth.

[dacidd]

Indeed it is..

While moving that I noticed it was WAY too Moga based...

[fireball94]

Yep. We need to update it seeing as Linque, Maudlin, and Pinith don't venture in here anymore.

[dacidd]

Come sticky please!

[Viziroth]

what happens when ava is cast directly on top of the unit so that the unit is in the center of the cast?

[fireball94]

1x1's would go down and right. 2x2's, it depends on the corner. The bottom and right corners would go up and left. The left corner would go up and right. The top corner would go down and right.

[dacidd]

Blarg!!!! I have to type all this just to ask for a sticky because there's a lame arse limit on characters...

[maudlin27]

its funny, that this is probably more important for playing SP than the guide to the faction.

I find that a bit puzzling seeing as this features in the first part of the guide! Maybe I need to make it bold so people don't miss it.

While moving that I noticed it was WAY too Moga based...
Back when I first did it moga were the kings and voil the lackeys. How times have changed :(. Anyway when revising it I tried splitting it roughly between moga and voil due to the heavy moga weighting it previously had, although I'm always open to more input especially with the voil tactics etc. (since I have more experience with moga than voil overall)

Yep. We need to update it seeing as Linque, Maudlin, and Pinith don't venture in here anymore
Right that's it. SP guide thread spam v3 coming up - you will notice me! :p

Ahem, anyway a very useful guide/picture set by linque, it's helped me many times when I've forgotten which direction corresponds to which knockback! My only problem is that I'm usually frantically loading pages while running the game trying to get to the picture, and by the time I get it+realise that actually yes I had remembered the knockback direction correctly, my turn's ended :p.

Oh, and giving this thread a bump for newer players out there! Truce also did something similar for aoe knockback but checking the link I've got it's since expired :(.

[fireball94]

Then just remember and hope you are correct. :p

It's worked for me. I haven't had to look at the knockback pictures in a long time.

[Linque]

Yep. We need to update it seeing as Linque, Maudlin, and Pinith don't venture in here anymore.

Wahuh?

I'd still like to pair this with a Relocate Guide, so maybe I'll do it if I'm online in Pox at the same time as one of you so that you could help.

[AlphaOzcar]

Really useful, needs to be stickied!

[fireball94]

Wahuh?

I'd still like to pair this with a Relocate Guide, so maybe I'll do it if I'm online in Pox at the same time as one of you so that you could help.

O.o I thought you died! Haven't seen you in a while. Or did the new expansion bring you back?

[Linque]

That, and new forums. Besides, this break wasn't even that long.

[CSchwarz]

Wahuh?

I'd still like to pair this with a Relocate Guide, so maybe I'll do it if I'm online in Pox at the same time as one of you so that you could help.

1x1's would go down and right. 2x2's, it depends on the corner. The bottom and right corners would go up and left. The left corner would go up and right. The top corner would go down and right.

I'm not sure if this affects things, but I know you have a 2x2 knockback chart out there somewhere, and I think I've figured out the puzzle on it. Aaaaactually, I'm going to check if I have it in my archives, and if not go forumdiving for it.

Edit: Whups, it's included in the same post as your knockback guide.
http://www.poxnora.com/forums/listthreadreplies.do?fid=18&tid=242985&p=0
http://linque.pp.fi/Pox/knockback2x2.jpg

Though, it confuses me so I may be wrong about it.

My theory is that, from the various behaviors of the AI with 2x2 units, I've come to believe that the servers consider the main square of a 2x2 unit to be the topmost corner (top center). I think this is the space where Swarms and Rider units drop as well, but I haven't been paying as much attention.
If my theory is correct re:knockback as well, then what I'm thinking is that 2x2s affected by knockback behave similarly to 1x1s would in the topmost space.

Also, when a 2x2 is knocked back 2 spaces up-right, when there are two 1x1's along that site, the upper left of the two (the one next to the topmost square) always takes the knockback damage. (Have had this happen consistantly in SP trials with the rock trap), but I haven't tested this in a controlled environment, nor have I examined 2x2 knockback into a pair of 1x1s from other directions.

[fireball94]

I'm not sure if this affects things, but I know you have a 2x2 knockback chart out there somewhere, and I think I've figured out the puzzle on it. Aaaaactually, I'm going to check if I have it in my archives, and if not go forumdiving for it.

Edit: Whups, it's included in the same post as your knockback guide.
http://www.poxnora.com/forums/listthreadreplies.do?fid=18&tid=242985&p=0
http://linque.pp.fi/Pox/knockback2x2.jpg

Though, it confuses me so I may be wrong about it.

My theory is that, from the various behaviors of the AI with 2x2 units, I've come to believe that the servers consider the main square of a 2x2 unit to be the topmost corner (top center). I think this is the space where Swarms and Rider units drop as well, but I haven't been paying as much attention.
If my theory is correct re:knockback as well, then what I'm thinking is that 2x2s affected by knockback behave similarly to 1x1s would in the topmost space.

Also, when a 2x2 is knocked back 2 spaces up-right, when there are two 1x1's along that site, the upper left of the two (the one next to the topmost square) always takes the knockback damage. (Have had this happen consistantly in SP trials with the rock trap), but I haven't tested this in a controlled environment, nor have I examined 2x2 knockback into a pair of 1x1s from other directions.

Yep. It works that way.

[CSchwarz]

Yep. It works that way.

.........................Very specific, thank you.



Just for the audience.... Which part of my post was correct?

[Datachild]

Great Work

[sahaal]

nice guide. All you newbie sp'ers out there had better learn this. Knockback is golden in the land of the peaks.

[Viziroth]

bump cuz of awesome

[dacidd]

Linque's guide not mine.

[dacidd]

Bumpity bumpin bumper

[Viziroth]

should be stickied IMO

[Heartsauce]

Cool, the only thing I don't get is how do you know which square is pointing what way? someone explain pleaze.

[kzkilla]

very good to know =)

[Mnrogar]

How about adding how the damage stacks up? I don't get it. What's the math behind it? I mean like if three units are in a row, you hit the first which knocks back into the second... sometime I see the first one get 10 damage, then the second gets 5, if they have nowhere to go then other damage pops up, 5 then 10. What if there are 2 in a row?

[mrobviousj]

How about adding how the damage stacks up? I don't get it. What's the math behind it? I mean like if three units are in a row, you hit the first which knocks back into the second... sometime I see the first one get 10 damage, then the second gets 5, if they have nowhere to go then other damage pops up, 5 then 10. What if there are 2 in a row?
I believe it's 5 for each space that the champ would have been knocked back (so if it is knockback 3, there is one free space then a champ, the target moves back 1 space with no damage, then moves back into the champ, taking 10 damage along with the other champ). Right? Also, could you do a thing for rock traps? I'm still a little confused when people approach from a non-straight direction (i.e. they walk into one of the traps diagonal spaces). Thanks- this has been really helpful! =D

[Slayer697]

This guide is the single most useful tool in any pox player's arsenal. I give it two thumbs waaaay up!

[fireball94]

This guide is the single most useful tool in any pox player's arsenal. I give it two thumbs waaaay up!

What are you doing here?

[Linque]

Well, it'll cease to be useful in a few days.

[hughmann]

ooo spoilers!

[Agroagro]

This still confuses me....

Im in the dark about

avalanche
eye belt
gale force

[Srinshee]

Hi, it's a great thread for Knockback directions... can you add a little guide/help with the damage done to the different champs for other champs/impassable squares? Thank you... Sri

[dacidd]

Hi, it's a great thread for Knockback directions... can you add a little guide/help with the damage done to the different champs for other champs/impassable squares? Thank you... Sri

5 damage per space knocked back.

[CSchwarz]

5 damage per space knocked back.

This, notably totalled up before reducing or increasing damage: if a shrine is hit for 1x5 and takes 3 (5/2, r^) damage from halving it, it would take 5 (10/2) damage, not 6 (5/2, r^, x2), from a knockback 2.

I'm not sure if Cyclops Eye Belt KB is handled separately or totalled into KB attacks.

[dacidd]

This, notably totalled up before reducing or increasing damage: if a shrine is hit for 1x5 and takes 3 (5/2, r^) damage from halving it, it would take 5 (10/2) damage, not 6 (5/2, r^, x2), from a knockback 2.

I'm not sure if Cyclops Eye Belt KB is handled separately or totalled into KB attacks.

I thought shrines took 5 damage as well?
btw I edited in a decent description on KB in the OP..

That's and acronym sandwich lol.

[Agroagro]

Champions knockbacked into shrines does 3,5 & 7 damage for knockback 1, 2 & 3

pretty sure, but im surprised cause i thought knockback 3 would get rounded up to 8

[CSchwarz]

I thought shrines took 5 damage as well?
btw I edited in a decent description on KB in the OP..

That's and acronym sandwich lol.

They halved it when Gale was new and people were tossing crystalized champions at the shrine.

Champions knockbacked into shrines does 3,5 & 7 damage for knockback 1, 2 & 3

pretty sure, but im surprised cause i thought knockback 3 would get rounded up to 8

Really? Weird...
It seems like it would be r^, but then, Pox hasn't been much for consistency... but in the same mechanic? X_x;;

[k0nker]

Maybe I'm a bit dense, here, but I have a few questions.

From the example pictures, how do those arrows apply on other maps? Is there a general rule as to the directions, or is all knockback put into four quadrants on the map, with each quadrant going towards the middle?

Also, knockback is always determined from the source of the knockback, not the target of it?

New and Loving SP!

[fireball94]

The knockback has nothing to do with the map. The spaces with arrows are where a champion that is getting knockedback would be and the direction. The middle is the source of the knockback, which is what is used in determining direction.

[NebulousQ]

The knockback has nothing to do with the map. The spaces with arrows are where a champion that is getting knockedback would be and the direction. The middle is the source of the knockback, which is what is used in determining direction.

I think its the opposite of this, the arrows show the direction the middle champ would go if the knockback source was on that space.

[k0nker]

I guess my basic question is on any given map, how do you know which way something will go when knocked back by a spell?

I understand the arrows on the example map, but how does that translate to any other map?

[NebulousQ]

I guess my basic question is on any given map, how do you know which way something will go when knocked back by a spell?

I understand the arrows on the example map, but how does that translate to any other map?

Map doesn't matter, consider the arrows and spaces relative to the middle champ (the voil bomber).

Consider your target, then look as the space were you want to cast the spell, then look at where that space is relative to your target, go to the guide, find that space relative to the voil bomber, and the arrow on that space is the direction in which your target will be knocked back.

[k0nker]

Oh wow!

Thank you for the explanation. :)

[fireball94]

I think its the opposite of this, the arrows show the direction the middle champ would go if the knockback source was on that space.

Oh, lol.

I guess I look at it the way I described. That's how I run it through in my head.

[Linque]

Oh wow!

Thank you for the explanation. :)

I take it this means you don't need any further clarification on the issue?
The example pic #2 should be pretty straightforward, but I could make a few more example pics if need be.

[Linque]

Could this be added to the original post?

Guide to Relocate & Pull

Here's the square priorities when pulling or relocating for the first two squares away from the puller/relocater:

http://linque.pp.fi/Pox/p&r-small.jpg

When you relocate, one of the squares 1-4 must be available (not blocked). If all of those squares are blocked, you are unable to relocate. When relocating, the unit will automatically end up in the square with the highest priority, that is the square with the smallest number on that picture. 2x2 relocation is a bit more complicated, I might do some work on it later.

Pull works exactly with the same mechanics as Relocate, except it has a few extra rules. Here's the one-two-three of pull:


Any relocatable non-adjacent enemy unit within 7 spaces can be pulled.
The pulled unit can never end up further away from the puller than it originally was, but it can end up in a different space equally far as it were before the pull.
When pulled, the unit will go to the square with the highest priority that is not blocked (in the picture above, square number 1 has the highest priority with regards to the Voil Transporter in the picture. Second highest is square number 2, etc.)
A square is considered blocked if it is occupied with another unit or relic, it is impassable, a chasm or lava.
If the unit is unable to reach a square equally far away as the one it is residing in, you cannot pull the unit.
This is where it gets complicated: if the unit being pulled is already on the highest priority space available, it will still be able to be pulled, moving to the next highest priority square the pull can reach (that is, max 3 spaces away).


A few examples with the help of the picture above:
- A unit is standing on square 6 and the Voil Transporter pulls it. The unit will be moved to square 1.
- A unit is standing on square 11, but square 1 is blocked because there's a chasm there. The unit will be moved to square 2.
- A unit is standing on square 7, all squares adjacent to the transporter are blocked, the Voil Transporter pulls. The unit will end up in square 5.
- A unit is standing on square 5, all squares adjacent to the transporter are blocked, the Voil Transporter pulls. Because the unit itself blocks square 5, the smallest number square the unit can reach is square 7. Therefore the unit will end up in square 7.


NOTE:
I think there were some inconsistencies when I tested. For some reason, I think when I pulled from square 5 and only square 1 was blocked, the unit ended up in square 4 instead of square 2. Need to do further tests to figure it out.

[Poxbuster]

Nice posts, pull is just as important as knockback imo.
Together with some throwers you can easily cross whole maps with the little mogas :D
RUSH RUSH RUSH and shrinekill xD

But i'll stop posting now cause i see ive already posted as last one on the first 10 threads xD
(just spreading the SP love ^_^)

[dacidd]

Added Pull & Relocate guide to original post. Will work on changing links to actually images once my computer is done acting up :)