Cactuar Crate - Ronin Edition

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Sokolov, Jan 20, 2015.

  1. Ohmin

    Ohmin Forum Royalty

    It could just be that they are considered "barbarians" by the Elsari (who have their own paladins and whatnot).

    Ultimately though, I think this is best left as a case of balance and mechanics beating out lore.
     
  2. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    To be clear:

    Personally... I don't have a problem with there being "humans" in IS, and I do understand why, gameplay wise, it's weird to have a Paladin champ that also benefits from Barbarian-theme abilities.
     
    IMAGIRL likes this.
  3. IMAGIRL

    IMAGIRL Forum Royalty

    If your going to bring up balance over lore... Paladins now have access to Barb mechanics that were not designed around them. Alternativly Barbarian theme, now has to contend with outside synergy which might end up having detriment (nerfs) effects in the future from broken combos. (Speculation)

    Example. Inquisitor Magnus now having access to the Stone Clan.
     
  4. IMAGIRL

    IMAGIRL Forum Royalty

    One of the reasons why I brought it up. I did not think this was your decision. I could not see you just up, and decide to redefine a race without thoughts for the mechanics involved.

    Fantasy, Logically, and Mechanically it just doesn't make sense. Lore wise it does. I think Gedden did this honestly... He probably has something in mind for the Anti-Paladin themed Gamolen expansion, but I;m not quite sure he is fully aware of what he did.
     
  5. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    Races in general have to be dealt with - there's been a bit of race-creep over the years, and some older stuff like Vashal (which was given Beast when they were a fledgling theme), can probably stand alone now.

    In general, I think most champs shouldn't be more than 1 race unless there's a specific reason for it, such as the new Cyclops Symbiot (which was missing construct, but will be added).
     
    limone1981 likes this.
  6. IMAGIRL

    IMAGIRL Forum Royalty

    The Human Race does exist in a capacity though. We do not need to make them Race: Human, Barbarian. We can just have the 'civilized' Humans be Humans, and the Barbs be Barbs. To my current knowledge there is no ability that affects Humans, and has to be coded for both Humans, and Barbarians.

    Are all the Humans in FW supposed to get Barb too? No? Is it because they are Witches/Wizards? The IS humans also have their own thing going for them. They are Paladins. Should be really change it up? Should we allow Paladins access to the Clans? Should I. Magnus be running around with Stone Clan on him?

    Barbarian Paladins just does not make sense mechanic, lore, or definition wise. On of the biggest reasons I advocate this is the word 'barbarian' was literally define by the church. I can assure you, that Knights of the Church -Paladins- were not classified as such.


    On the Subject of Vashal: Still not sure why they have the double race. I do have fun abusing them in a KF/UD beast split. I honestly do not think I should be able to though.

    (I understand that is a broad statement. For now -at least in part- it hold true.)
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2015
  7. OriginalG1

    OriginalG1 I need me some PIE!

    you guys are attacking Desecration. really.
     
  8. OriginalG1

    OriginalG1 I need me some PIE!


    Chronomancer and obelisk of foresight is the only reason that bg works. It worked efficiently because you scryed down to near 50 hp on avatar. Scrying comes at a price. I would start by nerfing Chronomancer's spell shift ability. Bump it up to six charges like you did Aspect of death's death kneel. Then hit Obelisk some how because this relic is only used in devious ways.
     
    Sealer0 likes this.
  9. Cydna

    Cydna Forum Royalty

    Not 100% sure I think Isran and Magnus have Race: Barbarian because they grew up as Barbs and were recruited into the Inquisitor or whatever. So lore-wise, it does make sense.
     
  10. OriginalG1

    OriginalG1 I need me some PIE!

    They only reason I could spam that spell like was because of chrono and nora cow helping me out. Being stingy with my nora helped too. You where cutting off my fonts quickly. Could I have really saved that much 175-200 nora to spam 70-80 damage of desecration over 4 turns, possibly. Could I defended myself while saving so much nora, possibly. Could I also mount an offense to travel to your shrine, possibly. Could I spam 2x desecration every one of my turns without Chronomancer, not a chance. Could I get the combo so quickly without the Obelisk? Maybe, rune reveal comes down to luck, but scrying leaves my shrine vulnerable.

    To use desecration, six time with just one Chronomancer requires 24 charges. That means there needs to 12 champs deployed after I deploy Chronomancer to be able to pull that off. Nora is tight for me, I am trying to stack up nora, defend my self, and get offensive units over to your shrine for spells presence/possible attack. Dose that seem possible without the 1st turn Chronomancer that I got against you? Making over to the shrine before transfiguring and having Chronomancer out was a lot of luck and Obelisk of foresight.

    My battle groups operate under very circumstantial conditions. Is the bg so op that if you were to play against it again I would easily win the same way? Who knows, but I bet my opponent would scry less.
     
  11. OriginalG1

    OriginalG1 I need me some PIE!

    I do not know what you mean. I feel like you are starting to become sarcastic, maybe it is just my mood. Sorry if you felt like any my of statements were a personal attack. I hope I made my point that chronomancer, and obelisk are the main force behind this bg.
    upload_2015-3-4_1-17-40.png
    Glimpse into the utter-dark is so my avatar can go incorporeal or my champs can depending on what is going on.
    Ice quake is if i desperate.
    Summon ant should probably not be equipible.
    This is how I enjoy playing the game.


    edit: that is Disturbed Spirit in there.
     
  12. KingJad

    KingJad I need me some PIE!

    nerf nora beast. You heard it here first.
     
  13. kalasle

    kalasle Forum Royalty

    Wait, there's a great solution that's perfectly in line with the recent trend:




    Give it Backlash.
     
    Netherzen and KingJad like this.
  14. Agirgis1

    Agirgis1 Forum Royalty

    What DMR said.......nora gen is op
     
  15. KingJad

    KingJad I need me some PIE!

    Unholy tomb doesn't like it
     
    SlickDragon likes this.
  16. Netherzen

    Netherzen I need me some PIE!

    Why does phantasmal creeper got 8 damage?He doesnt have basic attack or any attack ability,its a completely useless stats on him.
     
    SlickDragon likes this.
  17. Netherzen

    Netherzen I need me some PIE!

    Worm got hit hard this with patch in few subtle ways.
    More counters to tomb means that their nora gen and global damage is reduced.
    Few worms losing undead did make them cheaper but it also prevents the use of festering wounds,a key spell that was 1x auto in worms and some run 2x,it would provide damage worms lack and anti healing so champions cant get away to heal.I suppose it could be replaced with the spell:decay,however decay is bugged and only does 50 percent damage rather then the full damage its suppose to do.
    Polluted martyr losing race:worm is also bad,since he provided a amazing wall of meat and high damage worms lack along with speed and synergy with necrosis.He does need to be nerfed,but i wish he would stay a worm.I know he is a dragon,but he if full of worms,just like carrion collosus.
    The buffs to putrid creeper and blinking creeper havent given worms anything that they need,like champions that can actualy deal damage.
    Putrid creeper is an low damage 80 nora tank,and while he is a decent rune he doesnt really fit in with worms,worms lack good targets for ravish/consume(polluted martyr would be a good target for these abilities but he is no longer a worm) and he needs to compete with dusk creeper for globes,which is not an easy task.
    Blinking creeper offers some amazing utility and ranged damage,but he is a fragile expensive champion without real damage that worms needs.
    The nerf to short lived also impacted worms via doom/dusk creeper and martyr but it was too strong with soul collection champion.
    I still support the proposed change in cactuar crate towards necrosis to avoid any future problems with worms.
    Worms still look like a solid playable theme,but i think they could use some love,some could use buffs(like carrion collosus and bloodworm) while others could be changed to have more synergy with other worms and necrosis,so rather then being buffed,just be changed to be stronger via other worms and necrosis and weaker without it.,for example like rotmaw creeper.
     
  18. KingJad

    KingJad I need me some PIE!

    DecayingCondition

    Whenever this unit would be healed, it instead loses HP equal to 50% of the heal.
     
  19. Netherzen

    Netherzen I need me some PIE!

  20. Sealer0

    Sealer0 I need me some PIE!

    It's not a bug, the spell's wording wasn't changed with decay change.
     
    SlickDragon and SPiEkY like this.

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