You didn't watch the presidential debate last night

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by BurnPyro, Sep 27, 2016.

  1. Geressen

    Geressen Forum Royalty

    see people, this is why I stopped putting in effort ages ago.
     
  2. darklord48

    darklord48 Forum Royalty

    https://xkcd.com/1732/ this shows how rapidly the climate has changed in comparison to the changes that have occurred since humanity evolved.
     
  3. Baskitkase

    Baskitkase Forum Royalty

    I saved some "jams" shorts from back in the 80s when I was little. Should be fine.

    Actually, couldn't afford actual JAMS, but my mother did make me some pocketless jams-like shorts on her sewing machine and I was so damn proud of them. Love u mom.

    There's a lesson here... love your kids and do the best you can with what you have. They'll cherrish you so much that even though you have no money, they'll work so damn hard for you and when they grow up they'll buy you a house on alot of land and some cars and set you up for retirement because you deserve absolutely nothing less, even though the world is melting.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2016
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  4. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    I enjoy how this answer basically says more about Clinton than answered my question.

    As for not going to war, Trump's previous pledge to go after ISIS might put a wrench in those plans, and his stance towards China is riling up quite a bit of animosity there - I don't think it'll come to physical war, but a trade war will be problematic for the US economy. And Russia might not give people might of a choice either if they do end up invading Poland or Finland - not to say that that will happen, but there's been quite a bit of posturing lately.

    There is also a possibility of some kind of space wars if Trump does start to militarize space.

    In any case, my hopes for a Trump cabinet that represents change to money in politics has pretty much died with the kind of people he's appointed. I can't imagine these people are going to work with him to get money out of politics when it's money that got them there in the first place. Heck, at least one of them is basically in the pocket of the Koch Brothers.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2016
  5. Geressen

    Geressen Forum Royalty

    Protests:
    [​IMG]
     
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  6. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

  7. Dagda

    Dagda Forum Royalty

    pretty sure for evidence he mostly counters points about the specific DNC related numbers, whether they be debates or emails (/dates on which emails were put out). i don't think of that as being an unsubstantiated opinion.

    also, the second point is that sanders would possibly have been torn to pieces by an organized smear campaign, due to things the guy quotes that i assume are quite easily google-able.
     
  8. Baskitkase

    Baskitkase Forum Royalty

  9. DarkJello

    DarkJello I need me some PIE!

    I never said climate change was funny. Obviously we are negatively impacting the environment. Obviously we have a moral responsibility to conserve our home. Obviously I don't mind some of my cash being taken by gvt and used to fund research and such. Reading comprehension. It is the histrionics I oppose, NOT the valid research. I have probably done more to environmentally benefit the planet than any of you guys, so the attempt to scare/shame me has failed.

    I provided the link to Louder with Crowder because it is humorous, and I did NOT want to bore the thread to tears with reams of data.

    Al Gore blabbed away about it. Prez Obama blabbed away about it. And soon Prez Trump will blab away about it. 3 non-scientists...

    I trust all the scientists I know on this topic a HECK of a lot more than politicians trying to get rich off the hysteria. Good day to one and all.
     
  10. Comissar

    Comissar I need me some PIE!

    Oh yes? Do tell.

    As to the rest, you stated that 'anyone who says the science of globally changing weather is settled, is the actual enemy of science.', followed by a link to a site with abysmal comprehension of how climate science works. To me, this reads as 'Anthropogenic climate change is not a thing, here's why'. If that's not what you were getting at, then I apologise for mis-reading your sharing of a comedy article.

    Also, again, I'd like to see the work your scientist friends have produced on the matter. It's both relevant to the discussion, and relevant to my own field, so I'd be curious to know why they seem to think the matter is not urgent.
     
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  11. Geressen

    Geressen Forum Royalty

  12. BurnPyro

    BurnPyro Forum Royalty

    I have been to the moon. My moon friends know I've been to the moon.

    I just can't show you pics cause Elon Musk and the govt would try to use my tax payer money to also go to the moon. Firk them man. I can go to the moon myself, don't need no govt.

    Also you guys have probably never gone to the moon before so you don't know what you're talking about
     
  13. DarkJello

    DarkJello I need me some PIE!

    "Colleen Canfield
    You just need to get high.


    Matt Harrigan
    Nope, getting a sniper rifle and perching myself where it counts. Find a bedroom
    in the whitehouse that suits you 'motherTrucker'. I'll find you."




    This is one of those instances in which getting high was the best alternative. Consequences were consequential.
     
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  14. Baskitkase

    Baskitkase Forum Royalty

    I have mooned people though...
     
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  15. DarkJello

    DarkJello I need me some PIE!

    1) I pay significantly more taxes than the average American. I recycle. I voluntarily join groups to pick up trash in parks and along roads at least a few times each year. I drive an older but fuel efficient car. My wife drives an older but fuel efficient van. I don't have a yacht. I don't have a 2nd home. I don't fly in planes very often. I don't own a plane. I don't own a motorboat--but IT is a fun activity. I don't own a gator. I raise a garden each year. I have some trees on my small parcel of property. I cut my wood with an axe. I follow Dr. Jill Stein on Twitter, and have "liked" ideas as I saw fit. I am always willing to learn about new developments that will help conserve our planet. What else should I do, or not do, to be worthy of joining the elite green club of intellectual humans?

    2) So you recognize that the vid was on the comedy side, but you are angry that it was not technical enough? The science of global climate change is NOT settled. We, as a species, have learned a LOT. We should and will learn a LOT more. I am open to all the new info. I welcome it. How is that anti-scientific?

    3) My scientist friends/family are geologists, chemists, physicists, doctors, dentists, engineers... I never claimed they were atmospheric scientists. None of them are being paid to promote hysterical fear that keeps people awake at night because of what might--or might not--happen in 30-40 years. About half of them remember when the popular fear was a coming ice age. They are skeptical of the ever shifting models that keep getting it wrong over and over and over, and they have noticed all the BILLIONS of dollars changing hands each year. Admittedly, I don't personally know a lot of people that opt to place tons of faith in massive and centralized government.

    4) How much, if any, does the carbon footprint of each immigrant that moves to America--by mean average--increase annually as compared to life in their native country?

    5) If you had the wealth and political power to save the planet, what would that look like for the average American family? What needs to happen to prevent global catastrophe? I am genuinely interested in what/how the perceived solution would play out.

    Be well folks.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2016
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  16. Baskitkase

    Baskitkase Forum Royalty

    5) You walk yo ass to work
     
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  17. DarkJello

    DarkJello I need me some PIE!

    [​IMG]
     
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  18. Geressen

    Geressen Forum Royalty

    How will you handle decentralized goverment if you can't even compartmentalize wildly different issues.

    what in the big Firk does it have to do with climate change and the level of education and fields of your friends? is it just a buzzword you like to use as punctuation?
     
  19. Baskitkase

    Baskitkase Forum Royalty

    As long as I get to be the blue one. I'd not want to be a flamer.
     
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  20. Comissar

    Comissar I need me some PIE!

    Ok, real talk first. Your posts here stink of smug superiority. Your statement of 'I have probably done more than any of you [for the climate]', dismissal of anyones comments who happens to lack a postgraduate degree, deliberately polarising commentary of 'you can smirk now, but we will win the future', dismissive of non-trump voters by implying they're unemployed and uneducated, and numerous other examples of snide remarks aimed to paint you as the gracious successor who is being unfairly assaulted by the uneducated and unwashed masses.

    Interestingly, this on its own is, while irritating, not enough for me to feel the urge to pass comment on (until right now, obviously). What is irritating enough is how you then go on to act the wounded party when your deliberately provocative statements generate pushback. You do everything in your power to flip the narrative to paint yourself as the guiltless party, being persecuted for having an opinion.

    Also, yes, this is a statement on your character. But no, I am not using this to avoid arguing your points, I will do that in a moment. Nor am I claiming the attitude, frustrating though it is, in any way invalidates the arguments you are setting forth. This is just me telling you that the 'Stop being so arrogant, I've done nothing wrong by having an opinion' statements you're making are both grating in the extreme, and coming off as hypocritical.

    Good, this is genuinely commendable behaviour. I'm going to leave aside the jab you made at the end, because I am genuinely impressed at the efforts you're making.

    You misunderstand my objection. If you had posted the link and said 'ha ha, look how foolish these people are, they clearly don't know science', I would probably be on your side. If you had posted it and said 'it's worrying that people find this misinformation and read it, coming away with the impression that anthropogenic climate change isn't a thing', I'd definitely have agreed with you. However, what you did was link it following a post saying 'The science isn't settled'. From the context, I took that to mean you were using it as evidence to support your assertion that climate science is a conflicted field, and from that the common leap to then say 'anthropogenic climate change is false'. If that wasn't your intent, I apologise, but you have to remember that context is everything.

    As for why it can be seen as anti-science. You're right that a skeptical approach is important for scientific inquiry. Blindly accepting what you're told doesn't lead anywhere, it's only by testing and re-testing that we can make progress, and this includes testing tried and true concepts. Attempting to disprove a leading theory is fine, so long as your methodology is sound. Even if you ultimately do not, it's still fine provided you followed rigorous methodology. The link you provided did not. Instead it sloppily attempted to take down climate science with poorly researched arguments that have been debunked plenty of times. This, combined with the aforementioned context you provided it in, prompted the anti-science comments. By all accounts, it looks like a rejection of scientific consensus based on no grounds whatsoever.

    You did not claim it, but the implication is there when you say they have a strong opinion on the matter. A psychologist's word on climate change isn't likely to carry much more weight than a laypersons, for example. I would hope they'd take the time to research it a bit more thoroughly, they should have the skill set to enable them to do so, but it lies outside of their field of expertise.

    As far as I am aware, no research scientists are paid to produce media spin.

    Climate models are notoriously difficult to construct, there's a vast number of variables at play, all of which influence one another. Add into that the fact that we've only really had the computing power to produce accurate models within the past decade/fifteen years, and we've only really been paying attention to the possibility of global climate change since the mid 1900's, and it's not surprising that early models are inaccurate. The field is still very young, but models are constantly improving. It's also worth noting, and I'm paraphrasing but I forget who said it first, that models will never be 100% accurate, we can merely strive to produce the least wrong model we can, but they are nevertheless still immensely useful.

    I don't know. Presumably it depends upon the economic situation of their country of origin, their means of travel, the fuel efficiency of their vehicle of choice, the source of the fuel used for said vehicle at the time, so on and so forth. You'd need a human geographer for this kind of question.

    Simplest solution, cut all fossil fuels out immediately, drastically curtail human population growth, and probably see about cutting down on agricultural produce.

    Realistically, try to keep atmospheric CO2 from continuing to climb as dramatically as it has since the industrial revolution, continue conservation efforts (particularly in marine habitats), and explain to people that no, climate change isn't a conspiracy.

    The human race has already caused untold damage to the ecosystems of the world, and we've left a significant enough mark on the planet to warrant the classification of an entirely new era. CO2 in the atmosphere has spiked so fast that we've not even had the chance yet to see the full effects, and we may be past the tipping point already as a result thanks to the melting permafrost and destabilisation of methane hydrates.
     

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