troll'n

Discussion in 'Ironfist Stronghold' started by OriginalG1, Jul 28, 2016.

  1. Hierokliff

    Hierokliff I need me some PIE!

    Shrine is 45, font is 12, nora mine is 5/6, nora miner is 3/6/9.
    I think nora mining is bad in pvp, the game is so aggressive that its just not worth it in any way. kinda like deploying healers, armorers etc are not worth it, need meat shields, cc or dps/ranged. the damage output far exceds any type of defense. (but thats another story)
    if you have 1 font you will get 57nora, so adding another 5 per turn sounds good. but if you play dwarf/barbarian get a unit with camaradier/call to arms instead, then you dont lose momentum and still get a little nora advantage. we got some nora runes, might be fun to see if a nora deck could work .-)
     
    aseryen likes this.
  2. super71

    super71 I need me some PIE!

    Problem is grunts we're broken for so long about a year or so ago that I don't think anyone wants to see them super strong again yet.

    Also grints have historically low damage and rock defiance doesn't cut it anymore because they can't last long enough to get decent damage or high health
     
  3. OriginalG1

    OriginalG1 I need me some PIE!

    Herd, but part of rock defiance is a damage buff with +hp gain when attacked.
     
  4. Hierokliff

    Hierokliff I need me some PIE!

    If it would trigger on more things then just basic attacks i think it would be enough upgrade for it to be useful in pvp. its not often a fight are about basic attacks anymore. maybe its my own fault for using things with defense so the enemy has to use all aoe2/3 abiltities with ignore defense or those abilities are just to op.
     
  5. super71

    super71 I need me some PIE!

    Yes i'm saying you can't get enough stacks of that before it means anything, plus high hp in poxnora is pretty pointless as every faction now has dispel or insta kill options.
     
  6. super71

    super71 I need me some PIE!

    Nah defense stacking was being abused by many different themes and factions. After the original gedden re-vamp trees had ridiculous defense, and then dwarves, and then grints, and now every ability goes through defense.

    Pox constantly creates new abilities to counter old abilities, and then create new abilities to counter those new abilities, it's a silly vicious cycle.
     
  7. Hierokliff

    Hierokliff I need me some PIE!

    Its not so horrible atm though, if all those abilities where on attack-chain and maybe not range 5 + AoE3 with 80% damage, think the game is getting balanced, but in a way you are so right... noticed that we have different type of fear in the game, so Prestige/fearless/iron will just works on some abilities and not all that are fear
     
    super71 likes this.
  8. aseryen

    aseryen I need me some PIE!

    It's cause the devs have no clear standard or reason for what a Hero is other than lore; and to drive purchases when they were released. Quite honestly Heroes need to be removed until revamped. Period.

    As with Titans and Aspects, no rhyme or reason to any balance changes until there can be a constant that the whole community can use to look at and gauge runes of similar race:class or theme/role. It kind of goes to show that since the devs were willing to make a player made expansion; but then set no criteria for these runes to stand for further expansions that they have no clear idea or understanding for how to keep the game in a relative state of balance; this is also supported by their resistance to create ban lists or further x1 deck limit runes. Sadly the Devs don't really show much intelligence for sustaining balance for the future of Poxnora when they deny or refuse to acknowledge that other game modes will be beneficial for Poxnora. @Sokolov what runes do you use to gauge the entirety of Poxnora? Cause basic Champion runes like Jakei Maiden are/should be different than Heroes; but by what standard? You mentioned Heroes are getting a look but to what degree and will it be at all relevant for themes without Heroes? @Sokolov @Senshu

    There's no reason to have had a change to Avatars at this time. Poxnora as a whole interacts very little with these types of mechanics that would/could have created more game modes had there been an actual comprehensive look at what Heroes/Titans/Aspects/etc do for Pox.

    There has to be a time where we go from the proverbial 5v5/2-1-2 to ARAM or Twisted Treeline so to speak. Campaigns have too little incentive; at least until DoGs can implement a rune creation campaign that each player essentially creates their own runes to play either in PvE or PvP.

    Problem is it takes years to redo the MSPaint maps that any kind of real code work is not to be expected from DoGs.

    Idk why it takes so long to make runes...it's honestly laughable; although DoGs has a tendency to work on the end of the rope without a knot; to only create another knot or slack for runes to fill the void and become OP...

    I'm optimistic but when their track record is the Poxnora that we have (and a really horrible NUX) no database and navigation is horrible) will the PS4 release be just a facelift or actually implement features that creates games within games...cause we have already been fiddling around with runes for years, it's time for a spin on how runes:roles interact with the game.
     
  9. super71

    super71 I need me some PIE!

    Too much clutter in the game and too many abilities doing similar things.

    Right now high health isn't really an issue, I had a guy the other day abusing magnify beast, I simply hit his super champ with doom.

    Grints are like a mild super champ once they get going, problem is so many things stop super champs and the like in today's meta.

    I'd be interested to see what your running though, if your still playing them.
     
  10. Hierokliff

    Hierokliff I need me some PIE!

    Iam not running them anymore, i do test alot in IS atm to see if i can find something fun/challenging.
    The good thing with rock defiance when i got it going is that every champ turns into a superchamp, unless you play SL with loads doom/petrifiers i dont think you can doom enough of them. I did give up when i noticed so many damage abilities dont trigger rock defiance, and that the AoE for it is almost as small as the damage abilities useally are so need to cluster up and lose fast.
    For superchamps IS have the best spell 'spare part', its almost rude to use it and get zedin/bastion (or other shielded unit) with phys immune, multiattack, rock defiance...used it in 3 games with IS/UD split with Goblin king, it was silly fun but so OP i had to stop or ill never be able to play just FF IS. just need to remember its only upgrade 1 that goes to non-constructs.
     
  11. Hierokliff

    Hierokliff I need me some PIE!

    Here is my latest BG, and from the original there is just 1 troll left, Grintmaw Bouncer.
    its a fun deck, but not troll based at all its focused on class:warrior and stacking its abilities defender,battlemaster,commander + nexus auras and shrouds, need to get rid of more equipment but have alot of fun testing all equipment

    warriors.JPG
     
  12. super71

    super71 I need me some PIE!

    It's much better combined with k'thir and combined effort spell =).
     
  13. Hierokliff

    Hierokliff I need me some PIE!

    Maybe/probably, but i dont play treehuggers :)
     
    super71 likes this.
  14. Hierokliff

    Hierokliff I need me some PIE!

    Hmm trolls aint so bad, they just need to the right barbarian/support with them. atm it looks like Magnus+bastion are their favorite friends. trying to get bastion first and get him to survive long enough to get some trolls+rocks out and magnus so when he dies his shield is moved to magnus. magnus is amazing with trolls, just because of grintmaw hymn. so far only testing in pvp, but an adaptive troll would be awesome to have.
    Trying to learn to play without medal of valor, here stonarmsash + rock defiance is almost as good, that with adaptive and a very passive playstyle is building up HP alot. the grintmaw shaman is a key unit here, its a pain to use it still for me but when i do position him/her/it right its a winner. using 2-3 non rock defiance units with stonearm sash feels like a must still. but a good thing with no medal of valor is its a free slot for all my IS decks.
     
  15. Hierokliff

    Hierokliff I need me some PIE!

    Gonna wake this thread again, its so good so if new IS players want to read about trolls they should be able to find it. And not only that, think they should try trolls with Lodestone Megalith. and if they have tried it earlier its time to do it again, thats how good that rock is atm. my latest deck is having marsh trolls as main unit with Lodestone behind them. Wish we had a few more cheap/efficient Troll/Rock D meat units, yeah i am also using Rockforger for those free small rocklings, but cant say i love him yet.
     
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  16. OriginalG1

    OriginalG1 I need me some PIE!

    Post a fresh bg when you get it going man, I would not might doing some more trolling myself!
     
  17. aseryen

    aseryen I need me some PIE!

    Groble with Power is pretty much all you need for cheap and efficient that has Rock Defiance imo.

    Forger may not be in the same place with ToV having a cap now. With Tacitcal Manual Equipped and ToV for the stall+uncapped Dmg paired with the uncapped max HP RD can produce, Rockforger scaled pretty quickly.

    I think that Unbending Force in a Troll deck could take the place of an extra unit. All depends on how the player weighs each rune on the board vs in their hand.

    As for when/what I will be playing it will be more around the expansion release, before or after idk, I'm going to test out all the new interactions with the new Constructs and see which ones work best with RD.

    Perhaps Identity Crisis will be fixed then and I can play some SP/IS...don't really want to touch that split (even though it's one of the better ones) right now till that rune is fixed.

    If I get any games in this month I will get a Dwarf/Troll deck going, I'll record all the making of cause I may switch part way through. Oh yeah i was going to work on a Soul Bond RD deck...somehow.
     
  18. aseryen

    aseryen I need me some PIE!

    Oh yeah there is also the new UD/IS Clone Defiance deck
     
  19. Hierokliff

    Hierokliff I need me some PIE!

    Using marsh trolls instead of groble, because Power Attack aint a basic attack while Pummel are. This game is so strange with the wordings "an attack" "a free attack" "basic attack" "extra attack". it should just say "basic attack or non-basic attack" not alot of different words... useally its ok with different words but it feels like instead of using classes that we dont see for abilities, some abilities searches for keywords in the text.

    This matter crazy much for Flamebreath Ballista and its assault mode.
    A troll that is covered by 2 flamebreath ballistas that can Pummel gets of 6 attacks for insane damage for very little AP, and if the target has evasive it doesnt matter since the ballistas do full damage anyway if i saw right, the game is so fast now. allthough arrow eater seems to work against ballistas found one to try it.

    so this bad rune, aint so bad, its just a matter of learning what are basic attacks and not.
    its more of a gimmick deck then a working deck, but wow its crushing BOT without even being forced to use attack myself until my Megalith are in range for the shrine or ballistas, the shrine goes down so fast with 2 trolls and 2 ballistas :p 12 attacks for 4+4AP on the trolls. The ballistas gets so much AP because i use wildeye bracers on them and they trigger also on basic attacks and on eachothers. so troll pummel = +2AP then +2AP for the ballista nearby for 4AP on each ballista, so its free attacks.
     
    aseryen likes this.
  20. aseryen

    aseryen I need me some PIE!

    Yeah you really would think all that would have been reworked when the client was first being redesigned.

    I doubt they copy and pasted any of the previous code from the client so some would have had to spend the time reading most of the nonesense we still have and said..."yeah that makes sense"

    I absolutely absolutely agree the wording for a lot of the code can be properly consolidated.

    Good to note on Pummel vs Power Attack. Guess I've just forgot since I rune Groble for Spare Parts(RD) and the power attack can be bestowed so it's all kind of two fold when I look a Groble. Typically won't play that rune unless in a Spare Parts bg
     

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