Cactuar Crate: Planar Disturbances

yes they are exceptional champions and cheap as well.

 

In no world is 75 or 78 nora considered ''cheap''

 

Riftlord certainly does not need any buffs.

 

no idea why i said that, i had it in my mind they were around 72... which while not cheap you get a lot for that is what i meant.

 

I was actually thinking of a cost reduction for Riftlord, Arroyo Rift got a nora cost increase because of how easily it buffed Surge: Spirit right before Surge was removed from the majority of champions that had it. This hit spirits particularly hard and I don't think the cost increase to Arroyo Rift is still reasonable considering that spirits now have so few sources of Surge.

It was nerfed twice increasing it's cost by a total of 8, I don't think he'd suddenly start dominating games if it were reduced by 3-5 nora.

 

Riftlord does not need a buff. You don't see it often because FW has moved away from spirits and few people play SP mixed meta, but it is still an incredible champ.

 

How about instead of making exaggerated statements with no basis you actually provide some kind of explanation for why this 'incredible' champion that nobody runs doesn't need a tiny cost decrease.

Saying FW has 'moved' away from spirits is such a bullshit statement, everyone dropped them because they got nerfed into the dirt and this is one of the reasons why.

 

I run him in my split but thats more due to HH combo with units that have vitality creation. Do I think he's overcosted? Sure. However most people seem to think he's fine and I will admit that he's good as is, so I doubt he needs a buff right now.

 

The point I am making is that he is overcosted because of the increases that Arroyo Rift received which are no longer justified because it has much less usefulness since the Surge changes.

Reducing it's cost again is hardly going to break the meta and it would help out the Arroyo/Spirits theme which are currently rather poop.

 

If a champion is being run in a lot of high-end meta bgs, then I do not think that champion needs a buff.

If arroyo do need a buff, then do it through other runes. Not riftlord.

 

There was a time when anything under 80 was considered cheap in SL.

 

I havn't seen him in an SP meta bg for about a year and I don't think he was ever popular in FW meta.

Still waiting for an argument that amounts to more than 'he's good and people run him'.

 

I play him in my meta SP deck. It is my most consistent deck and it has been copied by other players. In this deck, he is one of my ideal first 5 deploys.

 

The consistency of your deck and however many people copy it has nothing to do with this and obviously you'd want to deploy anything with Vitality: Creation early on.

Do you seriously think that a cost decrease like -3 nora would have such deeply significant effect on the game?

 

Yes

 

A quick search in the patch notes forum tells us that the last time arroyo riftlord was changed was July 2016.
http://forums.poxnora.com/index.php?threads/planar-disturbances-patch-notes.23670/#post-325005

Since then, the same arroyo riftlord that you can play right now was an integral (ie. you always start building the deck with 2x this rune) part of two decks that were top5-10.
Those decks are the surge: spirit deck that was FW's top deck prior to December 2016 (when portal got its deserved nerf and skeletons took over as the popular surge deck) and the SP/ST knockback spirit deck that was developed by calisk (a variant of SP/x The Resistance decks, all of which featured the current arroyo riftlord).

While both of those archetypes have been dismantled, riftlord is still a solid include. As I have already mentioned, I am running it in my primary deck. @Chris was also running it for quite some time in his SP/ST deck (which has also been copied by many "top" players). I am pretty sure he swapped it out a few months ago and I would be very interested to hear his take on the rune, both in regard to his deck and in general.

So what this suggests to me is that Arroyo Riftlord, as currently designed and costed, can be run in top competitive decks. The reason why Arroyo Riftlord is not played more frequently right now is contextual rather than because of some innate badness that you would like to correct with a 3n cost decrease. While Arroyo Riftlord is not an auto-include champ, it clearly is capable of filling a niche role in a fairly robust theme (spirits is second only to beasts in terms of the amount of possible theme deck archetypes) or in other decks that might want to include a versatile meat generator.

To me, this niche state is the ideal spot for a rune to be in. If it's not an autoinclude it isn't first in line for nerf cries but, as other runes are added and changed around it, I am confident that this rune will be included in top decks in the future (assuming pox continues at a reasonable pace of development + release).

So now I put it to you, why do you believe that Arroyo Riftlord deserves a cost decrease?

 

riftlord is a decent stand alone champ. in my deck is it above this curve for many reasons.
1. it starts of with +7hp from st bonus and 2 on deploy. another 5 with sp banner.
2. with banner and +5 hp from st bonus the summons from 66 hp of meat instantly
3. i run slipped
4. i run pilgrim - i havnt had my riftlord ever die when he has cleanse and regen.

if you run him stand alone he is average - but has the potential to be exceptional

PS i run the 81 nora version

 

Perhaps I'm being dumb but what does slipped have to do with him? Fuel rage off the summons?

 

yes

 

No, actually the last time it was patched was in December 2016.

Which happens to be the same time that you state Skeletons took over as 'the popular surge deck'. Pure coincidence i'm sure.

Portal was never nerfed, a quick search in the patch notes forums tells us this..

Your following argument is just a load of bullshit based on incorrect information and a load of nonsense. What runes you or Chris used to run proves absolutely nothing.

Already given that explanation and you've skirted around it in every one of your replies.

It's all well and good parroting on and on that he's a good champ and that you, Chris and your pet dog run him but that doesn't have any impact on the argument I'm making.