More polarizing and depressing medical issues in Europe

I don't know if anyone here recalls me bringing up the Charlie Gard case/issue. I seem to recall that many people either didn't care, felt it was a one-off, or otherwise dismissed it. I could easily be remembering wrong though.

Welp

It's happening again: http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/alder-hey-applies-high-court-14008680

What say you?

 

There isn't too much more to say.

I'm assuming that the baby has next to no chance of survival, and that trying to treat it would cause it to suffer more than necessary.

Then you have the dilemma of whether you should allow the parents to cause harm to it, as well as their future lives in pursuit of that faint chance.

I don't know the answer, I'm just glad I don't have to make that decision.

But note that in the UK, while a much discussed issue, it doesn't come with the ideological baggage it would do in the US, and I do kind of object to trans-Atlantic ideologues using it as a means to push their chosen creed.

 

I feel like other countries make a far bigger deal about these things than locals.

At least that was definitely true about the Charlie thing.

 

another large group of americans and italians and others ( basically people that are afraid to let things die before they plunedered the souls for their team)
trying to treat human babies worse than we treat dogs and cats?

this Bane Shift keeps happening.

 

Very difficult, truly. Medically/scientifically I do understand that termination can be the best option.
But I have to say,, as a parent I would probably go to italy, even with such a small chance ,because even the treating doctors use the word chance (however small).
heres why:
After everything is done, and if things should go bad, I have to be able to look at myself and know that I literally moved every rock, lifted every tile,, everything! i have to know i did everything within my physical/financial power to help my lil boy,
If not ,, I will probably never come to terms with myself,,, I will come to terms with his death,, the pain,,, but never myself.
asking myself what if? never.

 

An interesting thought but I think in terms of how people feel after such an event would generally show the opposite is true. By allowing the removal of life support you accept that nothing else could be done and can move on from there. If you force extra treatments you will always think there was one more thing you could/should have done. Both are sad undeniably, but the ability to let go is extremely impactful for one's mental health in my experience.

 

The baby's been in a coma, so, not really.

I think I understand what you mean... But for the people that chose "their creed", it generally applies to everything, everyone, everywhere (usually). From the little I've read, most of the people that were upset were in Europe, the news just didn't care to cover them. How else would people in other nations get the news if not for people informing them.

Do you know how far people will go to keep their pets alive? (stupidly far) And governments allow them to do all sorts of crazy things too. It's not a very good comparison when pets often get treated better than dying human babies.

There's also the issue that the hospital's administration is basically, wrong. It's already been determined that the baby would be fine for travel, the government doesn't have to pay anything because of crowd funding, etc.
So, the idea of the baby being harmed further is faulty. The baby can only benefit from being transferred. All the hospital's admins (and the government) are doing is exercising their power. I would think European countries, being more globalist minded, would jump at the chance to cooperate with other nations for medical treatment.

That really only applies when there is near 0% chance of success. Which in this case, there is a much better chance, and plenty of medical professionals agree.

 

fixed it.

are you agreeing with badger or claiming coma babies cannot suffer?

 

As mentioned, this is not that hyped in the EU at all. Its a US chaines to religion problem.

Im going to be very blunt here, but its not about you and your peace of mind knowing you did everything. Its about another human being suffering and its your responsability.

Its an incredibly hard difference to accept, like Gav said, if you do it for your peace of mind you might never get out of the mindset that more could be done.

 

so the medical professionals in england say nothing can be done.
but the medical professionals in Italy say there are more options we can try.
So who are the medical professional ?
we just go with the DR.s in England? not all medical facilities have the same ability.

(I remember a few years ago the head of European medical asso. was on his way to America to get procedure done to his heart then wasnt done in Europe! )

I understand your point, and I def worded it poorly,,, its not about my feeling .
But if another "Professional" is telling me, I been seeing your childs case,,
and theres a few things id like to try that the last hospital didnt, at least before we terminate him,,im gonna say nah?were good?
I understand that the baby at times would feel some pain and discomfort, all I can say is I would want you to fight for me. Even if it
hurt some.
Listen,, I had to drive my dog to get put down, I had to pull over at least twice because I couldnt see the road with my eyes filling up with tears.
I understand at times letting go can be the best option, thats reality, no doubt. And healing will begin...
But I at least would have to see what the dr's in Italy have to say.

 

I told you the Italians and americans mixing in probably do not have the childs best interest at heart.
the doctors in England probably know more about the case.

its not about what is best for the parents and their state of mind, it is what is best for the child that matters. and in this the parents are not able to make a sound judgement.

 

I don't really see any point speculating unless anyone has the facts.

 

But that's what forums are for

 

yeag we have a system.