Well it has started

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by chickenpox2, Nov 4, 2020.

  1. chickenpox2

    chickenpox2 I need me some PIE!

    Us election is back and we will see if Americans still want a murderous dictator for a leader
     
  2. Ohmin

    Ohmin Forum Royalty

    Ooh, politcical threads are fun! Hmm, off a good start I see... I'm all for sharing one's opinion of people of course, but...

    Not sure who you're talking about here.

    For all their faults, neither Trump nor Biden have murdered anyone (that I'm aware of, unless you're counting Iran's Soleimani for some reason... or the hopes and dreams of Hillary Clinton), nor have they acted dictatorially in their respective political offices (unless you count withholding federal funding in return for firing a specific individual from Ukrain's government, for some reason).

    Neither Obama nor Bush are up for reelection either so...

    Again, not sure who you're talking about here.


    Anyway, while we're on the topic... The election results have proven to be predictably "interesting." The AP, in all their clearly unbiased and unquestionable journalistic powers, have named Joe Biden to be the winner of the election, despite numberous outstanding votes that have yet to be counted, and numerous allegations of wrongdoing in multiple states, but most noteably in Michigan, Georgia, and Pennsylvania (initially). Litigation is set to start tomorrow.

    For everyone's sake, I hope that any and all allegations of fraud are properly and appropriately dealt with, so that the winner of the election (as determined by the Electoral College, not any media outlet) can properly assure the public that their victory was definite and without question.

    I'm sure most everyone does or should feel the same way on this point? Well, as cynical as I am I like to be optimistic now and then.
     
  3. chickenpox2

    chickenpox2 I need me some PIE!

    Thank god looks like biden won America might go back to being a plesant place perhaps
     
  4. Ohmin

    Ohmin Forum Royalty

    You quoted my response, but you didn't actually address anything in it. I suppose by context I can assume you meant Trump being a "Murderous Dictator" but you didn't explain or show how. Nor did you discuss any of the points I brought up in the latter half of my comment.

    Like I've said, I'm all for people having and expressing their own opinions and feelings on a subject. That's a good thing. However, unless people are willing to explain/justify those feelings when asked to, there's not going to be much of a point to discussing things at this rate. Still, I think it's worth trying at least once more. At least tha's how I feel anyway, heh.

    So, therefore there are too points to your comment...

    I'll adress the first last... do you feel that America has been an unpleasant place as a result of Trump being in office? Because I haven't. Politics has certainly gotten uglier and the media more entrenched in propaganda and driving narratives; which is unpleasant, and of course the virus which has impacted the entire world is quite unpleasant, riots and looting in the wake of Floyd's tragic death are likewise unpleasant... but none of those are direct results of Trump's presidency. Regardless of how one feels about Trump as a person... there's absolutely no reason to believe those unpleasant things would not exist under a Clinton or Sanders presidency, nor that they will not continue to exist under a potential Biden presidency.

    On the other hand, for the first time in a long time, America's military has not expanded it's engagements but contracted them. There had been strong economic growth including for lower-income people prior to the Wuhan Virus, and there has been relatively strong economic recovering after the worst of the shutdowns have ended. Despite growth in reported cases there has been no corresponding increase in deaths recently, and the infrastructure for treatments and a potential vaccine have been established.

    What, specific action, has Trump done to make America "unpleasant" in your view, that would not have been done or would be easily corrected by Biden being in office?

    Note I'm not attacking you. I'm saying this for the sake of giving you an opportunity to explain your feelings and opinions and discuss them. If you are unable or unwilling to, that's fine, though it will preclude further conversation on the topic; I'll simply wish you well and move on. Perhaps others will be more willing to engage in stead.


    As to the other point...

    As I said above, there have been multiple verifiable instances of both election fraud (manipulating the votes, such as having tens of thousands of dead people voting in at least one state... with possibly more to be discovered) and a conscious effort to bar Poll Observers from doing their legally allowed (and in some states legally required) job of verifying that the counting and handlings of the ballots was done properly. And most of these instances are almost all in cities in states which during election day appeared to be going in Trump's direction, then some hours after midnight suddenly started getting almost entirely just Biden/Harris ballots (with no other marks, thus the large gains in the House by Republicans). I can go into these allegations in more detail if it's worth it.

    Whoever won at this point, the fact is that the appearance is that of large amounts of fraud, or at least improper accountability.

    Right now it appears that Biden won... but in large part only because that's the way the AP has called it, and tragically they aren't a reliable source on this, particularly since they seem to be trying to run cover for apparent fraud. (EG, claiming there is "no proof" despite multiple witnesses, showing and explaining how they discovered that people whose obituaries and death certificates had been issued prior to the election appeared on the public listings of who voted, etc.)

    As I said before, I hope that these allegations are dealt with properly. If they are indeed false accusations and Biden properly earned his victory, that's great, but it needs to be demonstrated or else it's probably that Trump's 71+ Million voters (with record, for Republicans, minority turnout and female candidates winning, for what that's worth) won't accept the results. Which would make the next four years very unpleasant. If the allegations are true it may be a bigger and more difficult to deal with problem, but it'd be better to know than falsely assume that our national elections aren't being manipulated through these kinds of machinations (let alone the impact on local elections).
     
  5. Ragic

    Ragic I need me some PIE!

    Ohmin, you might as well be trying to debate a drunk fan at a soccer game. Let the hooligans hoot.
     
  6. badgerale

    badgerale Warchief of Wrath

    Trump gone, BLM is over... British media might have to cover actual news now that there isn't any sideshow distraction... well, probably not but i can hope.
     
  7. chickenpox2

    chickenpox2 I need me some PIE!

    You still got British trump Boreus Johnson XD
     
  8. free20play

    free20play I need me some PIE!

    both parties do not care.
    it is a puppet show.
     
  9. Geressen

    Geressen Forum Royalty

    indeed

    do you want religious right wing corporate proxies or slightly more centrist corporate proxies?
     
    Alakhami likes this.
  10. chickenpox2

    chickenpox2 I need me some PIE!

    Don't they have the green party
     
  11. Geressen

    Geressen Forum Royalty

    LOL
    this would be a choice if they had proportional representation, but with their current system it is: "or do you want to vote for the party funded by the political party you agree least with so their real opponent gets less votes."

    so the greens and libtards ( and other small ones) are there to provide the illusion of choice.
     
  12. Ohmin

    Ohmin Forum Royalty

    It's not even proportional representation that's the issue (though I still think the larger states would benefit from proportional Electors at the least, less effective for smaller states though). It's that the system is rigged against third party candidates to begin with. It's why Bernie Sanders (technically an independent) keeps running under in the Democratic party for Presidential nomination rather than trying to be a third party choice. It's also why Donald Trump ran as Republican despite policies being different from more established Republican politicians (especially in 2016).

    As an example, in order to get on the ballot in the first place as a third party candidate rather than a Republican or a Democrat (including for lower offices than the President) you need to pass certain thresholds that neither the DNC nor the RNC need to meet. Likewise the "debate commission" which has been in place since 1987 is merely "bipartisan" at best, run by republicans and democrats rather than non-partisan or open to the public. To say nothing of the inherent media biases for the two parties (historically).

    It's like having an icecream shop that advertises: "We serve all the flavors of icecream you could possibly [be allowed to] imagine, both Vanilla and Chocolate!"

    Except I suppose this analogy would make an unintended slight to those two flavors.
     
  13. chickenpox2

    chickenpox2 I need me some PIE!

    Begone (T)Rot
     
  14. Ohmin

    Ohmin Forum Royalty

    Yes, because as we all know, once someone leaves a political office they cease to exist or hold any influence whatsoever.

    Still, I don't expect much in the way of logical thinking from someone so consumed by hatred as you seem to be. Though that hatred was fed to you like fowl making foie gras, it was still your choice to consume it (unlike the birdies, whom are given no choice).

    You know, I heard a clip from an interesting interview, I forget what it was from, but someone was interviewing one Mike Rothschild about "QAnon", whome the Rothschild claims to have "examined." I'll give him credit for an interesting point he made. That there are some people that look for an "easy answer" and cling to it. They are looking for someone to blame for all the problems in their lives. For me, it's always been about what the facts show, the truth, but for some whatever justification they have made is more important. "It's all [this person or that person]'s fault!" or "Those people are to blame!"... and it's based on emotion and flimsy justifications that don't stand up to honest scrutiny. Because it's more important to uphold their prejudice than to take the time, effort, and discipline to honestly examine the facts. To admit that maybe they were actually wrong (and/or fooled by someone they trusted) and look again, and with a more critical eye, at the basic premise and whether it was ever true to begin with, or if it was accepted because of emotional needs, rather than logical analysis.

    Whatever happens going forward, I hope you do well.
     
  15. chickenpox2

    chickenpox2 I need me some PIE!

    If you truly believe then you agree Trump was worse than any other president in US history
     
  16. Bushido

    Bushido Devotee of the Blood Owl

    Everything you see on tv is either staged or a deepfake.
     
  17. Ohmin

    Ohmin Forum Royalty

    Interesting statement, but the logic behind it seems lacking. After all, it is based on accepting without question the very thing I rebuked in the first place. Even if all the lies you have swallowed were actually true though, I'd still rate others as worse regardless. And you wouldn't have to go back very far. Bush Jr. (and the legislators that supported the following actions) for example, for his stripping away of human rights via the PATRIOT Act, his starting a war against Iraq based on false pretenses; his administration's use of torture of prisoners, his covering for Saudi Arabia's involvement in 9/11, and so on. And that isn't the only one I'd rate worse, but it gets to the point.

    I have, I think, made it clear my disdain for both major politcal parties in the US, and also the well-funded media companies owned by only 10, no 7, no 6, no 5 major companies, and the tech companies with more money and power than many nations.

    Put simply... not everything they will tell you is a lie (that could be self-defeating anyway), but there is much more to the world than they feed you. I hope one day you'll see it, and all the wonders out there that await your discovery.

    Regardless, again, I wish you well.
     
    Alakhami and super71 like this.
  18. chickenpox2

    chickenpox2 I need me some PIE!

    What?

    There no possible way you can say dems are equal or worse than the republicans.
    Maga hatters stormed the capital and chanted to lynch Mike pence and you say that equal to Dems.

    There a clear good guy and clear pure evil if you can't tell the difference in morality then your morality is no better than a murderer.
     
  19. profhulk

    profhulk Forum Royalty

    I agree with this statement. People are looked at by corporations as an animal herd to be milked for consent and bled of your capital, labor, and debt until you die. The America you think exists does not. Read this book to understand how you are manipulated by your controllers.
    [​IMG]

    My advice:

    1. Quit watching television

    2. Cancel online media= Netflix, Hulu, etc.

    3. Stop eating GMO food. Drink pure water and eat good food.

    4. Learn common law

    5. Grow your own food

    6. Create your own family through reproduction

    7. Learn a useful trade that benefits people.

    8. Voting at the federal level is a waste of your time.

    9. Voting at the state level is more effective.

    10. Voting at the county level is the most effective.
     
    super71 likes this.
  20. Gaverion

    Gaverion I need me some PIE!

    I find ordering a family off Amazon is faster and easier. If you have prime, you even get free shipping.
     

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