PCR5 Suggestion Thread (illustrated edition)

I put up a lavatrap change (which you might have seen before). Would like to get another non champ in, but we will see.

At the moment it's looking like a bit of everything patch, rather than one with a specific focus. Are people ok with this or would you prefer a more specific aim (such as non champs, a particular theme, etc).

 

I like the all around thing as it can mix a few things for multiple themes up and lets me play different things more

 

Buff Goblins Foo

 

arr minos safe from changes?

 

I don't mind a mix of things now if we focus on a theme patch 6. Goblins ?

 

I think so for the moment. I believe dimension shift will eventually need nerfing, but since they aren't owning the meta right now i am happy to leave them be. The fact that one of the new public decks is minos is also a factor.

I think one of the ronin preview pics released might be a goblin (though it's not really clear) so a lot with PCR6 will depend on what happens with the ronin release. It will also depend on the new developer(s), and how much they want to take charge of things like this -- so PCR6 is a complete unknown at this point.

 

make sure public deck doesn't have portalwanker in cause prople will most likely want to nerf him

 

This is shortsighted imo. I want the good runes in public decks and I don't want overpowered runes in any faction.

 

me too but i hate when people who don't play UD think that something is "OP" and try to change

 

Rune: Deep Leviathan

I've always liked this rune for Cataclysm, but no matter what I couldn't get it to be worth running in a Fire BG. Cataclym is a cool ability that makes you want to work for it, but overall this unit has too many issues:
- Size & Range: 2x2, Range 1
- Speed & Charge Generation: 5 Speed, Attack Charge 2
- Terrible upgrade paths.

With Abuse Charge 2. You need to attack 8 times to generate enough charges. This becomes increasingly difficult when you only have 5 speed, you're a 2x2 and you have range 1.

Most champs with 5 speed are tanks, but this unit has low defense and relatively low hp.

Proposed Change
8 dam | 6 speed |range 1-2 | def 2 | 54 hp | 78 nora
upgrade path 1: Searing Aura 3 (base)| Consume (-2) | Cleave (+3)
upgrade path 2: Immunity: Fire (base) | Fire Acolyte (+4) | Fire Eater (+2)
Base: Attack Fire, Cataclysm, Attack Charged 2, Lethargic, Scale Armor

My idea was to keep with as much of the original design as possible, while making some changes to fit the rune into an actual working role.

BASE CHANGES:
5 Speed was too low, especially for a unit that is reliant on making attacks, however I wanted the "slow moving" feel to the rune to remain. I added Lethargic to accomplish this. Also true to most 2x2 units I increased his ranged by 1 to make him less suscitible to being blocked.

Defense was increased to 2 from 1, HP was increased by 4 and Scale Armor was added to the base. This is a big demon and I felt that looking at him made me think of a big hard to kill monster. I removed Fire Eater to keep the cost down, and since his main ability Cataclysm excludes him anyways.

UPGRADE CHANGES
Searing Aura (base): While it is overall not very good , it felt like it was once of his signature abilities. (He is 1 of 3 units with the ability). I think most would rather have Fire Aura 3, but with all the other changes being proposed I wanted to avoid making too many changes.

Cleave: Just looking at his attack animation made me think of Cleave. With the increase to his range this ability is okay. Also I felt it was important to have an alternative to Consume and Searing Aura for those who wanted a more costly build.

Consume: This ability was moved here to give players wanting a cheaper version an alternative to Searing Aura and Cleave.

Immunity: Fire (base): True to his original design, he's a fire demon. Figured he should be immune at a minimum. I also wanted to keep upgrade path 2 relatively simple to avoid eating up future design space.

Fire Acolyte (+4) : Although this ability recieved a recent heafty nora increase. It synergises well with Searing Aura and Cataclysm. I felt it would be a nice option.

Fire Eater (+2): If he were to be run in a fire amp build, having fire eater might be interesting. It may seem redundant to have both Immune and Eater as options, but due to design space limitations I did not want to spread this rune across too many themes. I believe they both have their places as viable options.

 

I am all for Deep Leviathan changes. However; I should think that some synergy with Lavaspout would be a more interesting way to go about it. Why don't we make them reliant on each other? I am not entirely sure how to go about it. Just thought I would put it out there.

 

please change cataclysm damage 40 is too high make it 20

 

Deep Leviathan got majorly weakened in the revamp, losing one unit of range and a rank of attack charged (even though it still wasn't very good at that point).

I'd wholeheartedly support this, IF it could actually be used (and its nora cost also reduced).
Remember though, it will kill any of YOUR units that aren't immune to fire (though in practice, that is mostly a non-issue, and it even heals many units).

@Daerthalus: Leviathan ALREADY has Fire Eater on base, why use up an upgrade path on lateral changes to that ability?

 

@Centuros In other rune balance posts, DoG has stated that they do not like upgrade trees that are too spread out. They prefer a champion to have a clearly defined role over one which can fit in any BG. The idea behind giving Deep Leviathan moving Fire Eater inot an upgrade was to avoid giving him a 2nd versatile upgrade path.
1 - I could have put Fire Eater on base, with Immunity: Fire, and Acolyte on his Upgrade Path, but it would be wierd, since why would u want Fire Immune when he already has Fire Eater. By sticking both on his upgrade path, I could limit the upgrade path's diversity, while still giving players a bit of a choice. +0 for Immunity: Fire, +2 for Fire Eater, +4 for Fire Acolyte.
2 - I generally do not like Upgrade Paths of: Ability X (Rank1), Ability X (Rank2), Ability X (Rank3); especially when one specific Rank is 99% of the time the best choice. So I wanted to shy away from this style of upgrade path.
3 - Fire Eater is generally a sandbaggy ability since it costs 8 nora, and its is arguably only worth it's price tag when you can trigger it regularily. Cataclysm doesn't even hit himself so why would he need Fire Eater.
4 - Scale Armor is often the Upgrade Picks on Deep Leviathan's orginal form, moving it to Base allowed people to have some better choice of builds.
5 - Total Nora Cost is also an issue. I felt it important to stick the champ in a certain nora cost range. Adding 8 more nora by putting Fire Eater back on base would make it cost: 86 nora!

Currently you have a number of build choices:
Cheapest: Immunity: Fire && Consume = 76 nora
Base: Immunity: Fire && Searign Aura 3 = 78 nora
Expensive: Fire Acolyte && Searing Aura 3 = 82 nora

 

Alternative
Cost: 78 ==> 80
Path 1: Fire Eater (Base), Fire Acolyte (+2), Fearless (-6)

8 dam | 6 speed |range 1-2 | def 2 | 54 hp | 80 nora
upgrade path 1: Searing Aura 3 (base)| Consume (-2) | Cleave (+3)
upgrade path 2: Fire Eater (base) | Fire Acolyte (+2) | Fearless (-6)
Base: Attack Fire, Cataclysm, Attack Charged 2, Lethargic, Scale Armor

Build Choices:

Cheapest (72 nora): Consume && Fearless
Non-Fire Beater (77 nora): Cleave && Fearless
Fire Eater (80 nora): Searing Aura 3 && Fire Eater
Acolyte (82 nora): Searing Aura && Fire Acolyte

@chickenpox2 I think lowering the damage to 20 would be an option, though personally I'd rather have it stay the same. The rune give you that feeling of working towards something BIG! and instills a feeling of panic in your opponents when they see him charging up and must rush to kill him before he hits 15. If you lowered the damage to 20, you'd need to lower the nora cost and make it easier to trigger.

 

Don't nerf the priestess, remember relocate ally works on any champ and a 2 spaces greater range while beckon only works on demons and has 5 range.
relocate ally is also only 8 nora so a nerf to 12 nora is over nerfing.
so beckon trades 2 tele range and champ type selection for a 2 nora cost and a quicker cooldown.

 

That quicker cooldown is what makes it over the top, dude.

 

so your saying that paying 4 nora more, 2 tele range and champ selection one worth 1 less cooldown?
I donno... maybe nerfing her speed to 6 so that she needs to upgrade her multi attack to beckon and then double tap might be better?

besides, doubleing beckon demon's cost would nerf maxx decks, currently he can fetch her if she down grade her multi, doubling the cost of beckon means not being able to fetch her at all.

maybe even increaseing the cooldown of beckon but lowering the cost or increasing the range?

 

so the nerf will only be giving it 1 or 2 cooldown right i'm ok with that as long as her range stays the same or even give her 7 range with 3 CD it totally worth

 

The ability will stay the same, she'll just cost more (nora)