No seriously, NKD is silly - 8 nora

Run Snogvie x2?He got like 3 sources of distract.

 

So basically the suggestion to deal with NKD is to build the BG with almost half of the champions off-theme?

Seems legit.

 

I'm glad my option is limited to running a 150k champ, preferably twice, in theme bgs where he has no place for the sake of having a small chance to deal with NKD (at 8 nora). I'm just gonna bust out that 90 nora cannon to then one round it with my 3 champs standing around the NKD champ.

Is this 2012 where people run AoV? Snogvie makes some sense, see above. Drummer with flourish is hot Bane Shift. So are all the meta champs with precisions.




Oh wait, silly me. THERE IS STILL SKYWING IMPERATOR! No worries, I will now continue to stomp everyone.

 

I'm probably not a great choice to decide if something is balanced or not but I've found that if you run several nkd champs your bgs damage output plummets to keep their defensive ability. Even at full ap if you attack more than once the defensive power is reduced greatly and if you leave one with low ap it will be focused over the ones with high ap. so you end up having to store or even waste a lot of ap on nkd champs. Abilities like dodge, block, reflexes and evasion don't force you to sacrifice offense for defense.

Is the problem the power of nkd in 1v1 situations or in general? Because 1v1 there are a lot of situations that are almost imposible to win. But in larger engagements the nkd side is wasting ap to keep defenses up and the other side is wasting ap to burn down nkd on champs they want to hit which seems more or less like a balanced exchange.

Several of the nkd champs are cheap because they don't have a lot besides nkd making them efficient which may add to the op feel of the ability as nobody likes seeing 60 nora champs camping out in a font taking little to no damage. If they had activated abilities they would rarely get used becuase of the need to save ap and if you stack up passives they may very well just become more powerful instead of loosing efficiency. Increasing the cost of the ability would hit efficiency but how much is a reasonable increase and would it change peoples feelings about the ability unless it cost so much more that the nkd player is consistently at a champ disadvantage?

 

Agreed, but you don't have to fill your bgs with them. Kas guide will always be good anyway. Shadowstriker is a baller fontcontester. You just smash them in your meta bgs.

 

I do agree with you,every faction has very limited and expensive options to deal with NKD(lol 8 nora).ST bonus and st spells/relics make it even more annoying to deal with.

 

What I hate most is that you have to change play style so drastically that it bothers me. UD is all about hitting the enemy with high damage. If UD misses every melee attack then UD is useless. I was able to beat some noob's (lol) ferrens with Minos pretty well but he had no idea how to use them. Yet it was really annoying.

 

Two games in a row facing multiple NKD champs. Both times the games dragged out for ages. (though the second game first turn Juya on Lost City means 3 fonts to 1 herp derp map balance). It just takes so much more attacks to get through those champs. And they're all so damn cheap, you can't afford to go spending nora on them. 60ish nora and they sit there taking it all.

Thank god my opponent was incredibly sub par for those games or I'd gotten whooped.

 

Should have voted me for council then. ST wouldnt exist yet alone NKD.

 

No they shouldn't have voted me, even if I wasn't there at a time. My light of glory would have brought the nerf hammer already. I would so buffed the crap out of them reavers.

 

This is something I'm finding to not be true. At all.

First of all, there are the counterstrike-like effects. So if the opponent tries to power-through NKD, your Damage output actually goes up.
Second, there is nothing at all stopping you from blowing all of your NKD champion's AP to one round something, then dropping Blizzard Cloak or Containment Unit, keeping them safe from counter attack.

Saying that an NKD BG's Damage goes down is about as ridiculous as saying that an NKD BG is slowed down by the ability.
People usually keep 4AP on champions when they move them across the open map, do the same with an NKD champion and they're just as fast as anyone else AND immune to getting jumped.

 

This is a good example of racism in pox, obviously NKD is strictly better than block or Dodge, two abilities that have their cost balanced for ages in pox.

Another example is the relic that makes you impervious AND shileded. For several turns if lucky. And on several Champs. Compare that cost to the spell that gives IMPERVIOUS and SHIELDED for one turn.

So obviously ST has "advantages" in pox. Just like KF has "disadvantages". Its how the devs want it and obviously its how the council want it.

Plus NKD is also good at making ppl quit pox, simply because its stupid and creates booring games.

 

I just listed some ways to counter it in SL, and SKYWING IMPERATOR costs like 90 nora if u choose all lv 3 aoe which has cd 3, sounds too costy.

I believe what u were talking about was Containment Unit and that relic is already in the nerf list.

Check out here http://forums.poxnora.com/index.php?threads/cactuar-crate-ronin-edition.10438/

It has been identified as imba by devs. I'v already got who is the racism in pox. Thank you for ur example.

 

For the record, I was joking about Imperator. I might very well be the worst rune in SL.

 

My most recent experience with nkd comes from a jakei only bg ( I pretty much only play bgs with some sort of theme behind them, part of the reason I'm probably not a good judge for balance ) I find if I have several nkd champs out I kill stuff a lot slower then when I have my other tanks or melee because the ap isn't being used for offense.

You bring up spell and relic support for saving the nkd champs, the opponent can do the same when trying to kill them. Potentially bypassing the ability as a whole and the nkd champ has then wasted the ap it was saving. If you are going to bring other runes into the equation then the opponent gets to as well.

I agree a nkd champ is just as fast as a same speed champ without nkd in the early game but once combat begins the need to constantly have ap on them slows them a fair amount.

Again this is only my experience with them, I actually enjoyed the old nkd better when playing it. The new one feels as though I am being punished for wanting to fight ( spending ap ) but it is also unique in that it requires ap expendature while it is not your turn perhaps there are some who enjoy the ap management.

 

Like for racism.

 

So seriously, if you compare NKD nora 8 with block 2+dodge 2: 10+10=20 nora, u realize how pox is. Those two together gives ONE miss per turn if enemy is all melee or all ranged. NKD cost some ap, but saves your champ and if the block is not used, the ap is not spent.

 

you know what's racist in pox? When some one says the N word...That's right!















Noob






It is our word! A fellow player did not include me into conversation simply due to the fact I was uncommon! Imagine my outrage by such an act of disgrace!

 

I think one of the problen with NkD champs its the faction where they are, i mean, yes i play IS, we have many spells to counter NkD, but this spells are one champ target, so we dont have to be experts to know what will happend when i cast such spells, yeah that snow sexy blind costing 30 nora, the ST bonus, plus that heal also hitters champ ST have, its a perfect combo for that hability to work, test it on SP or UD and NkD wont be so good

 

I would suggest to change nkd in ine of twk ways:

1) make it cost 3 ap, not 2
2) make it to an ability with ap cost 2 and cooldown 0 for each block. U need to activate how many blocks u want, and they last only for 2 turns, so u loose the 2 ap regardless if the enemy attacks or not. Still same protection like now, but u can not counter attack or move if u want to keep protected.

 

what in the hell is wrong with you. does it give -5 nora instead of +8?