@R334P3R It is more than actually accepting that people like creativity. What is the game win con? Shrine subjugation. Everything else are means, not goals. If you do not keep this in mind, then you are fooling yourself... While we can consider that most players will choose the normal clash of champions game style, we should always be aware that there are many ways to achieve the shrine kill goal - whenever we are facing stealth we have to consider that the guy have the shrine rush option, as an example. Adapting both your gameplay and BG, identifying your opponent BG, his game style and weaknesses and strengths and counter playing is the essence of this game in my opinion.
@doubtofbuddha I was thinking about making a "those who are ignoring MW24, please like this" post, but I wouldn't know what to do with all those free likes, neither would be able to like my own post...
I agree, I just had already said most of that early in the thread and wanted to be short and to the point, since I had been pretty long winded in previous posts .
Ok pookie, I'm gonna give you this picture and I want you to draw arrows towards the spot(s) where Dest's posts touched you: Oh.
Oh also the reward itself should be the ability to create said battlegroups in the first place. As long as options are not narrowed down something will eventually come up with some of that frisky spice. Choosing to play runes which are not good by people's standards or non efficient themes in a competitive environment is your choice alone and you should not be rewarded for it. I sincerely doubt that the 20 (being generous) people you will be playing against on a daily basis will not seek out the best runes to compete with each other. I love how iPox comes up in every single on of these discussions and find rather hilarious how one of his constructions which are most likely used by him alone and perhaps two other people result in people raging because it all comes down to the same thing which is small population.
The reason people rage so much is because people find a way to win with out following the "flow of game process" as I described earlier. People assume the game should be played that way all the time but really that flow is just the stepping stone to achieve the ultimate goal of killing the shrine. And @mw24 (if he hasn't already ignored me) I could play competitively but the meta is boring as hell and I don't have time to keep up my rating anyways. I get much more enjoyment out of winning games with non meta runes and creative bgs (Even if it's 2 out of 10 that go in my favor) than with a stale meta BG.
So why shouldn't that be the flow? Why are the advantages of having them so great that they justify enraging a proportion of the player base?
If we keep threading that path, this game will more and more look like a buffed Pokemon version, and less like a deep strategy game. In the end it will be like "my fairy uses hyper beam in your groble!" "Yeah! Super effective", rinse repeat until one side snowballed enough. Exaggeration? Quite... Still, it is a bit near of what those guys that want to force feed us into the deploy-fight for fonts-get advantage game flow want us to have as Poxnora...
Okay. So where is the line then? Should the deploy fight for fonts style not be part of the game? If it should how much of the game should it be? Would the game be better if it is all about "creative" off the wall bgs playing against each other?
The flow SHOULD be the typical deploy and capture fonts etc. But what I'm saying is that it shouldn't be limited to that. There are battlegroups that don't need to follow that flow to win. Because people are so conditioned to the typical flow, when someone doesn't follow it and it results in a win. The player who followed the flow typically complains because they assumed their opponent would play just the same as them. There are mechanics and combos that are broken when they are put together and those NEED to be addressed. There is no argument against that. But player who play with the regular "flow of game" should realize that there ARE drawbacks to not following the typical game flow and that those battlegroups CAN be countered. Since those BGs are not played against too often, most players don't know how to counter or anticipate what the opponent is up to. Since its out of norm, its much easier for those players to complain about the BG instead of thinking outside the box and actually trying to counter the BG.
Creative BGs will never prosperate that much, simply because the usual armada font battle is too effective and less prone to being countered. Usually trick BGs end up revolving around some few interactions or runes, and crumble down when countered. If they get too popular, they get both countered more and lose the surprise effect that makes them popular. In this sense, it is more like the trick BGs entering through the weak spots of the usual BGs than it is a matter of being trick against trick most of the time. So, trick and alternative BGs should be let to run rampant freely, without any restriction(unless it promotes the truce-lock OP situation of a no-play by one of the sides), for the greatest restriction is usually within their design.
i dont know how you could implement this, but it would be nice to play with a non - meta / multi powerful runes, abilities, spells etc / super combo / exploit/bug bg and actually have a fair chance to win. i would enjoy such a game more, i may actually like pvp, 1v1 then. since almost everyone is using these powerful bg's, you end up losing in pvp, then realise you need to use equally or more broken bg's to win at all. so another player is converted to using broken Bane Shift, eventually maybe 90% are. you also need the new expansion / current runes as they arrive so powerful, even after nerfs. its funny to play against the insta win combo's once, then it just gets annoying, a lot of 2v2's ended this way when i played. the matchmaking system always used to suck, idk about now i havent really played. its not just the insta win stuff thats a problem though. i know it would be boring to limit pvp to just one faction, so these interactions / combos etc will always be there and found and making powerful combos is the idea of the game. but its difficult for a player to design a competative bg from scratch, most copy, have to copy to win, just tweak.. takes the fun outa designing your own new bg and playing it and getting some wins. matches are usually one sided though, never even, through choice of runes compared to theirs and skill. a massive percentage of available runes are just fillers, not really needed and do not get played much... you cant really use many of these in a bg.
mid fonts used to annoy me since i usually always lost it early on. but without a mid font and that nora advantage games could grind on for much longer.
What did I create in this thread lol. All jokes aside my main point is rewarding players for using under-powered/under-used runes instead of metas and currently strong bgs. I'd like to see daily rewards/ heroic achievements for using sub-par runes or something along these lines. Was playing a guy the other day using deep elf mercenary, deep elf scout, even some puppet masters. I ended up winning but it gave me hope, if only for a little for this community again seeing a player not crutching on a meta like I was that game. On a side-note i'd really like to see dow rewards expanded to maybe the top 20 or something for each faction and do the rewards every 2 weeks or something instead of what it is now. Maybe the top 10 players per faction and the bottom 10 ?
The current quests rarely encourage meta decks, so I think the system is ok. More wouldent hurt though. The real reward is simply the ability to break the meta. Bottom 10?
We do...we nerf them to the ground so they can't be played (compete within ranked) anymore! That's why there are maybe two playable (and I mean competitive) themes per faction...except maybe SL where there is like, what, one and a half? But never fear, big things are coming in 2016 and I guarantee that includes big nerfs to those pesky, overplayed themes! Just hang in there neighbor!
When I mean bottom 10 I mostly mean the guys that don't win a lot in the lower leagues, but still play their faction a ton. Seeing the same players win drums of war over and over and over again gets old. Rewarding players for using their faction a lot but not winning a whole bunch may encourage them to keep playing.
What do you define as competitive? Can you list the themes in each faction which you think are competitive?
sure, I'll play along: FS: Murkwater/Psychic IS: Pally/barbs KF: Archer/Deliem ST: Frost/Lonx SL: Dragons/skeezick FW: Witches/wurms UD: Minos/fire SP: moga/lightning These are purely my opinion as maybe there are better, more superior options out there especially for the factions I don't play. I can tell you in SL, Dragons are decent, skeezick are semi-decent, everything else reeks. I do not play SP, FS, or UD much so those may be far from accurate.
