My opinions about monks

Discussion in 'Split Faction' started by IronStylus, Sep 18, 2016.

  1. IronStylus

    IronStylus I need me some PIE!

    I'm talking about FS/ST split, which is what I believe the truest build for the theme. There is not really too much wrong about them, but there are couple minor things I would like to point out:
    Silent master and Swift current are a really awesome addition to the theme and they work really well in their roles. Swift current's ability doesn't give him mobility though, which is weird and complicates some stuff in game. Maybe he doesn't deserve it, it's working as described anyways.
    There are many monks that have really similar ability set (something offensive, a discipline and nohkan do) and have the same role. I will list them:

    Khong monk is similar to Nohkan grandmaster. I dont really know what is the mechanical difference between counterstrike and mocking blow. They have access 3 discliplines, nohkan do and similar stats. I'm using grandmaster just because of inhibiting touch. Jakei adherent, boghopper thunderfist and nohkan apprentice are also very similar to those two, although their mechanics are slightly different and adherent has magical damage, apprentice has aura and thunderfist has 7 spd and precision

    Calm as raging tides has almost same role as swift current if I build him with dragging attack and absorb, but swift current is 10 times better at dragging and evasing(?) ranged attacks. I know these champions play differently on the board and are a bit better in other things, but when building a deck, then making a decision about deploying, there is actually no big difference. Well, don't get me wrong. Calm as raging tides is an awesomely designed champion and he's balanced, I would just play swift current instead of him in any case, because he's a league above him.

    Jakei mindstriker could be reworked, as she doesn't add anything to the game and is just weak. (just an idea) She could be a wielder of psychic ping 1, which would work with nohkan do well and woulndt make her that weak.

    Silent master's most efficient build path imo, which is preparation and scrapper is really weird to play on the board, although both abilities are nice but don't fit each other.
    Another thing is, that disciplines are really scattered between the monks. I would really like to have ability to choose between ferren focus and some kind of discipline on some monks. Take the example of ferren master: For me it would be much better to be able to choose between ferren focus and freezing (or any) discipline and ferren focus on upgrades and have freezing aura on base. (nobody plays with another set than aura+weaken spells anyways, if you do, please tell me why and in what bg). @Sokolov I understand not every monk has access to disciplines, because that makes same sense as every imp not having mischief. But I would like you to look at the abilities specifically.

    Blackhand (excluding that ass ugly sprite, which is not DoG's sin) has this weird counterattack + elusive leap combo, which is just bad to play with. If I were opponent, 50% of the time I would use ranged attack to miss once and then engaged him with melee. He's also really squishy and doesn't fit in any role specifically. As monks are vulnerable to draw wins, and I currently don't see any fix to that, I think he could be an 8-9 speed runner that can contest really fast and effectively and be a counter to draw wins (see: if you draw him early, you win). Maybe this is too toxic to the game, but come on....

    Ranged disciplines is something that would be nice to have too. Currently there is only Jakei disciple that has crippling discipline (which is actually really good, because distract lasts 4 turns and is desired in the theme), but defiant is really strange to play with.

    I love the theme and nohkan do is really fun to play with or against. They're really cleverly designed, they're original and a bit different than the rest of the themes. They're not boring to play and need some experience, but they're great.
    Some of my favourite designs: Augur, Khong Monk, Swift Current, Firk Paraform.

    This is from a guy who played FS/ST since two expansions ago. (and sometimes play like Bane Shift, and that's why I lose but I don't blame monks for that)
    My current bg (I've changed it several times focusing on different mechanics every time):
    [​IMG]
    no, it's not my 20th NKD bg, but still something like 10th
     
  2. Etherielin

    Etherielin The Floof Cultist

    The difference between riposte and mocking blow is that mocking blow repeats the ability in all its aspects - E.g. a fire attack will be repeated by khong monk or if somebody casts freezing strike or some non-basic attack and misses, Khong Monk will respond in kind with that same ability.
     
  3. IronStylus

    IronStylus I need me some PIE!

    Yay! you read that post! Thanks for response. That's some complicated stuff right here. On the board or making a deploy decision, that wouldn't make any different to me, anyways.
    Khong is better than grandmaster that he deals more damage with multi/chilling strike, having only 6 hp less anyways. Grandmaster has this ripples thing that is not really worth its nora, but Im using her for the utility from forbidden discipline.
     
  4. davre

    davre The Benevolent Technofascist

    Just started playing a monk deck, and they are really good so far. I'm running it with a few leos and I added providence to the deck. It's great both for the leo synergy and for for all the relocate effects the deck can create. Silent master also lets you stack both block and defensive strike, which is great.
     
  5. IronStylus

    IronStylus I need me some PIE!

    providence has some nice tricks. If you equip it on leoss you get barricade, which if Im not mistaken is aoe iron will, which substitutes furry hat. You can also make fancy plays with augur if you equip him with that. someone's standing 1 space from the wall? you use hole the line for 2 ap, attack with augur for 3 ap and push him into the wall 3 spaces with double attack. I played it before the silent master, so I didn't think of cd reduction, but It seems to have even better synergy now. I don't know yet what's the best for them as every option makes the bg complicated and hard to use. They have really high skill cap.
     
  6. davre

    davre The Benevolent Technofascist

    [​IMG]

    Deckbuilding is one of my bigger weaknesses so it usually takes me 2 or 3 weeks to settle into a build that works consistently. Right now this is where I'm at for monks. About a week ago I decided to sacrifice most of my spares and invested some of that into two swift currents, a nohkan guide, and a k'ento.

    For anybody on a budget, raging tides can absolutely substitute for swift current, but SC is just a little bit faster, hits a little bit harder, and elusive leap is just a little bit more consistent than evasive. When you add in the light AP gen from his special ability the whole package is well worth the minor range loss, and it is a worthy upgrade if you can afford it.

    The core runes here are the two silent masters (irreplaceable and would be considered OP if it were in a more developed theme than monks/ferren), the two leoss magnates, and nohkan guide. Guide in particular is the addition that made the deck turn from mediocre to quite good (silent masters & leoss magnates were in there from day 1 so I don't know what the deck would be like without them) because the combination of commander and command-dodge has such a huge impact on both damage output and survivability of the whole group. The summons are just a bonus. I haven't tried it with 2 guides yet, since the deck is really tight on champ space and it's already leg/exo-heavy as is.

    Chirai anchorite is an interesting part of the deck because his upgrades have a huge impact on his viability. The default 75-nora version is the kind of champ you regret deploying, while the 70n sunder(1)/heal mass version really helps the deck's one-rounding potential.
    K'ento is just a strong midfont champ, though I think you can get away without running her. I am currently running the cheapest upgrades but I am not sure if that is the best for her.
    The first deck included the efficient 8/7 speed split runes but, aside from the seism, they don't fill any niches and they have been easy to cut.

    This probably isn't the final iteration of the deck but this is the "starting to get somewhere" version. The one thing I don't like is the lack of snowball potential/meat countering that we see as a minor part of most midrange decks these days, and an overall lack of utility (seism aside). The archetype is a champ or two away from being excellent.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2016
  7. NevrGonaGivUup

    NevrGonaGivUup I need me some PIE!

    Monks1.jpg

    This deck is insane. The amount of early to mid-game killing power it has is just mind-blowing, and it has the tools to ramp up in damage even more with furry hat and coordination tower. Trying to optimize your turns with silent master is really fun and challenging- this might be the most mechanically intensive bg i've ever played.

    The key rune that you guys forgot to include is the redfist/bluefist. He has incredible synergy with the reset from silent master:

    Redfist with at least 8 ap and 8 charges = 4 attacks
    -basic attack for 3 ap
    -charged flame fist
    -silent master reset
    -charged flame fist
    -basic attack

    With 9 ap, 12 charges, and 2 silent masters he gets another cycle, for 6 attacks total. I almost never use Ki strike.

    upgrades:
    Chirai anchorite ( sunder, empathy) - I want him to use his ap attacking instead of healing
    Leoss monk ( divert, invig 2)
    Fracturing boulder (strike, weighty)
    Redfist (supercharged 2, hunter:fighter) Soul bond is also good, but is more effective if you also take it on leoss monk.
    One silent master with scrapper and preparation, the other with scrapper and stat bonus speed.

    I'm still working on the non-champ runes, especially the FS ones. I'm not sure about the knockback spell- it usually just pushes them really far out of melee range, which is the opposite of what I want to happen.

    Let me know what you think.
     

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