A discussion on the future of the Paladin/Inquisition theme.

Discussion in 'Ironfist Stronghold' started by Markoth, Mar 25, 2015.

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Should Paladin and Priest Barbarians become Humans again?

  1. Yes

    78.9%
  2. No

    21.1%
  1. Markoth

    Markoth Lord Inquisitor

    Disclaimer: Everything that follows within this post is simply my opinion. The purpose is to spawn discussion about the future of the theme and its place withing the faction as a whole.

    Classes:

    Paladins: The core of the "Holy" theme. They are the offensive force leading the charge. Paladins should generally be tanky or at least able to take an above-average amount of punishment. Their offensive capabilities should be average at best (Damage in the 9-11 region) and rely on buffs to reach full potential. Good examples of "pure" Paladins would be Ironfist Inquisitor, Vengeant Knight or Paladin Commander.

    Priests: Priests are the primary supports of the theme. Offensively and defensively they should be weak (6-8 damage, 0-1 defense.). This keeps their cost low allowing them to focus on what they do best which is overwhelming healing and/or buffing their allies. Good examples of a pure Priest are Priest of Valdac and Ethereal Priestess.

    Shamans: Shamans primary function should be to de-buff enemies. Their offensive abilities should be equal or greater than Paladins but defensively they should be the weakest of the theme. A good example of a pure Shaman is the Veilwalker.

    Hybrids: Some champions have multiple classes and roles that overlap into multiple archtypes. An example of this would be Northern Cross Priestess or Cardinal. Both have abilities that supplement or heal their allies. They have offensive abilities greater than a normal priest but are usually pretty weak defensively and rely on healing to survive.

    Races:

    Dwarves: Dwarves are dwarves. They are pretty well defined within the game already.

    Barbarians: I am just going to come out and say it. Barbarians shouldn't be Priests or Paladins (Shamans make sense). I understand Gedden's reasoning behind changing the Humans in the faction to Barbarians. The Lore behind the cataclysm and how the Humans of Valdac had to adapt and return to an almost primal state to survive makes sense. However, the overlap will dilute the race's ability to develop as its own theme and find its own identity. Currently if I wanted to build a Barabarian deck it would almost be half a Paladin deck just with Warchief buffs bouncing around. Luckily there is a glaringly obvious lore reasoning for the return of Humans to Ironfist. The Inquisition.

    Humans: The Inquisition was created when the Paladins of Ironfist (The dwarves) realized that their numbers were dwindling and that they couldn't defend "the light" on their own. They looked at the barbarians and saw an untapped resource. Where others would have seen ferociousness, savagery and rage the dwarves saw opportunity. They took the greatest warriors of Sarnghaver and gave them education and training. Rage was directed and turned into religious zealotry. Savagery was tamed and civilized. Their ferocity was honed into an Iron Will. The result could hardly be referred to as Barbaric. They were disciplined and civilized. Human.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2015
  2. Markoth

    Markoth Lord Inquisitor

    Abilities:

    As previously discussed I believe that the themes offensive capabilities should generally be below average. But through buffs and synergy become an unstoppable force. Below I detail the abilities I believe are centric to the theme.

    Branded: Ok so branded is really a condition but I really feel strongly about the new version of Branded and its importance to the theme. There is currently only one way of applying Branded but after the next patch this will change. As the theme develops hopefully we will see Branded have new purpose. Perhaps an ability similar to Pain Curse that causes effected champions to Burn for X turns

    Mark of Al'Mara: Mark hasn't been around long enough or seen enough play to make a final judgement but I feel like it is slightly over costed (1-2 nora) for the effect. Currently the ability is only on 2 champions (Cardinal and NCPriestess) and Priestess will never take it over Cleansing Flame.

    Inquisition: When this champion is deployed and at the end of your turns, the closest opposing champion within 6 spaces becomes Faithless and Branded for 4 turns.

    Smite Enemy: Possible Rework?
    [​IMG]
    More incoming
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2015
  3. Markoth

    Markoth Lord Inquisitor

    Reserved for change ideas

    Burning Crusade: Change Brand for Mark of Al'Mara
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2015
  4. Dresnar20365988

    Dresnar20365988 Devotee of the Blood Owl

    I'm a big proponent of keeping barbs barbs and humans humans. There is a difference. Humans are civilized Barbs. Once you are civilized you are no longer a barbarian.

    Stat wise barbs should have little to no defense. Paladins should generally be armored. Barb casters should be shamans or wizards. Human casters should be priests or wizards.

    Other than that its all good in the hood.
     
  5. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    Lore-wise, PoxNora didn't have humans, but I think that in terms of what players expect and come to think about it, there's not a lot whole lot we are getting out of the whole all humans are Barbarians narrative.

    So I will most likely be making the non-Barb Barbs (hehe) human instead, or some other "human"-like name.
     
  6. Markoth

    Markoth Lord Inquisitor

    Not sure what there really is that makes sense name wise. Redeemed? Chosen? Citizens (Service guarantees Citizenship)

    Any thoughts on the possibility of future interactions with the Branded condition? Some sort of Seeker ability like Lightseeker, Bloodseeker etc that jumps to Branded could be cool.
     
  7. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    We could go latin, and pick something like Hominid, but yea, I am not sure what would work.
     
  8. Iskandak

    Iskandak The King of Potatoes

    Stupid idea: try something french? Apparently pala's are originally french. Although i wouldnt call them: **** sapiens cause they'd be shortened to ****'s and its gonna feel weird playing ****.
    But something like: homme?
     
  9. Iskandak

    Iskandak The King of Potatoes

    Ahahah didnt expect the language filter, sry for that
     
  10. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

  11. Markoth

    Markoth Lord Inquisitor

    Kinda remind me of the Visigoths in a way.
     
  12. Djangoguy

    Djangoguy The King of Potatoes

    I can read the text at the moment, does it mention making Barbarian a class and making all of them humans?
     
  13. sassquatch

    sassquatch I need me some PIE!

    All of the 'humans' are of a religious nature. Call them Al'maran like we refer to Catholics in real life. It extends beyond nationality and could even cross species boundaries due to conversion should the creative desire arise.
     
    Markoth likes this.
  14. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    Al'maran is pretty nice, I like it! Tho I am not sure I want to make it extend beyond species.
     
  15. sassquatch

    sassquatch I need me some PIE!

    Lol I wasn't really expecting it to be.... just pointing a real life correlation for a hybrid race as it were should the desire strike your fancy.
     
  16. sassquatch

    sassquatch I need me some PIE!

    It would make more sense than a human dwarf cardinal that got release with no flavor text explanation.
     
  17. Markoth

    Markoth Lord Inquisitor

    Oooh I like Al'Maran. "Follower of Al'Mara" Even sounds good for unit names.
    Al'Maran Clergy
    Al'Maran Knight
     
  18. doubtofbuddha

    doubtofbuddha I need me some PIE!

    I like your idea of Brandseeker, and honestly I think the Archangel of Al'Mara would be perfect for it. I just have this awesome image of her zapping across the board blazing sword in hand.
     
    Nora That and Sirius like this.
  19. Markoth

    Markoth Lord Inquisitor

    What would people think of:
    • Reduce speed to 6 from 7 (Cost reduction and remember she gets speed from Seeker)
    • Brandseeker added to base. (Jumps to Branded and Marked (From the ability Mark))
    • Abuse charged removed from base.
    • Multiattack 1, Cleave, Rampage to U2
    With Aerial Supremacy and Multi she would be about 85-87ish.
     
    Nora That and doubtofbuddha like this.
  20. sassquatch

    sassquatch I need me some PIE!

    While you are at it sok, you might want to consider making all the humans in fw race: Elsarian. It will provide more flavor and make it easier to balance themes and split bg interactions. Human could then be removed from the game. Of course if you decide in the process to restore some power to my fw/is pally bg, I wouldn't complain lol.
     

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