Carouse / Dwarven Racial

Discussion in 'Ironfist Stronghold' started by Axeraiser, Mar 1, 2014.

  1. Axeraiser

    Axeraiser I need me some PIE!

    Hey guys, well since there's lot of change about to happen as well as some major balance patches, I think now is a good time to discuss our 'racial' ability, Carouse. As it is now it's pretty much useless, not to mention not every dwarf has it so its hardly a Racial. Honestly I'd prefer to just scrap the whole mechanic and come up with a better racial, what do you think ? As the oldest race in Pox I think some sort of unifying racial is required.

    I understand that most of our best champs are Dwarfs , and too strong a racial might easily push some of them over the curve, some fun and flavourful would be nice though.
     
  2. JazzMan1221

    JazzMan1221 Better-Known Member

    I dunno, I kinda like the current racial. If it actually gave the rank of Resistance - Physical it was supposed to, it would be more useful. Carouse is very flavorful, and that 1 AP can be a lifesaver at the right time. Perhaps if the cost to use Carouse was lowered to 1 AP itself, so it could work as more of an AP transfer mechanism of sorts. Also, bumping up the HP bonus to 6 wouldn't be too much to ask IMO. Thus, the final version would give 1 AP, 6 HP, and a rank of Resistance - Physical (when there are 5 or more Brews out) to Dwarves. Not bad for a 1 AP ability.

    Oh, and don't forget that if you Carouse your champ, it also prevents the opponent from equipping anything nasty on you as well. If they waste an anti-equip spell to get rid of your free Brew, well..........it's plain to anyone how efficient that is for you.
     
  3. Axeraiser

    Axeraiser I need me some PIE!

    That AP is almost useless now a days, it was marginally useful back when D Kings were ran and people would always stay 1ap out of range and you could surprise them, now , not so much. IS has some of the beefiest champs around a +4 or +6hp boost is pretty inconsequential. 1 rank of Physical Resist when you have 5 out is again not much of a buff. The only slight benefit this 'racial' has is as you said to prevent negative equips, but we have plant of meta anti equip champs so this isn't that much of a boon.
     
  4. JazzMan1221

    JazzMan1221 Better-Known Member

    AP on-demand is useless? I beg to differ; AP, in ANY quantity, is never useless. The thing about Carouse is, since so many of IS's best units have access to it, you can't just buff it without considering the fallout. You mentioned this in the OP, but now you're saying that 1 AP, +6 HP, and a rank of Resistance - Physical isn't enough. How about when it's global, and available as a 1 AP ability? If Carouse isn't inherently weaker than other racials, you run the risk of turning it into another Boon of the Undead, due to its widespread usage. Furthermore, I don't really see Dwarves as the type of theme that requires a strong racial to give them status. Consider Lonx, for example. They are one of the strongest themes in the game, yet they lack a racial ability altogether. Why are they so strong then? Well, mainly because of Chieftain being amazing, but also because they work very well together and have access to a slew of thematic abilities like Reveal Race, Bulwark: Lonx, and Lonx Defender. Dwarves should exist as a theme in the same way, with Carouse being a supplement to their power.
     
  5. Axeraiser

    Axeraiser I need me some PIE!

    1ap that costs 2ap to trigger plus the requirement of an extra champion within 2 spaces is virtually useless yes. Carouse is bland, boring and frankly just plain bad. THe only time it was ever good was when you could equip the Brews to opponents for a debuff. Sure dwarves could go the route of a theme enabler, Command Dwarf or a Camaraderie champ perhaps, but it doesn't change the fact that carouse is still bad, and inconsistent by not being on every dwarf.

    I don't like having a half done racial that doesn't even do what it is supposed to do.
     
  6. GabrielQ

    GabrielQ I need me some PIE!

    If Ironfist font bonus is changed, Carouse could be made 0 AP cost to use and dwarves will sorta keep their initial speed intact.
    Also, since IS's cleanse options come from soul reaver/vial of holy water, a way of cleansing equipped champions would be nice for dwarves.
     
  7. Rapidice

    Rapidice I need me some PIE!

    About the cleanse, they gave IS Battle Matron's buff and Ivory wing in recent expansions..... not that they are meta, but the reply will be "You got 2 runes that have access to cleanse, add them if you need it".
    There was a thread on SOE forums about changing racial so dwarves would have a variety of brews, with different effects.
     
  8. GabrielQ

    GabrielQ I need me some PIE!

    Champion based cleanse isn't comparable to spot cleanse.
     
  9. yobanchi

    yobanchi I need me some PIE!

    While I'm not an expert on dwarves I'd like to see the dwarf racial be more entwined with the intoxicated condition.

    Say: Carouse-> when this champion is intoxicated it gains "stuff".

    Then have the blacklabel brew give intoxicated.
    Meadtrap could effect all champions (not just enemy).
    A dwarf could get Intoxicated greeting (all friendly champs are intoxicated)

    Perhaps more beer equipment is necessary as well.
     
  10. Tarth

    Tarth Devotee of the Blood Owl

    Does the game need racials anymore? The idea that a race has a defining ability is nice and all but shouldnt the races place in a faction or battle group be designed around a template that helps define each race instead of a blanked every X race gets Y ability?

    If carouse or dwarven racial X has to exist then it should be something simple that enhances the characteristics of the race as a whole. Dwarfs, as a race embody what exactly in this game? What do they offer to the IS faction? What makes them different from the rest of the factions races? Those are questions needed to be answered at a base design stage if you want to create a real flavor and not just have units that are dwarfs because they simply have dwarf as a tag.

    Something simple if it needs to have one could be: Locked and Loaded: When this champion is equipped with an equipment it becomes resistant to knockback effects and refunds 5% of the equipments cost. If more is needed add/take away as needed but something that requires a choice on who to " tick" with in the racial along with a mechanic that is thematic and uniquely dwarfish and works with existing mechanics with in the faction/race is better then some more stand alone imo.
     
  11. Morfeas

    Morfeas I need me some PIE!

    Private Blonde reporting in:
    The Dwarven "spend-AP-for-what-should-be-a-passive" racial sucks.
     

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