Dark blue OR & gun control

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by DarkJello, Oct 1, 2015.

  1. Ohmin

    Ohmin Forum Royalty

    True, but I suppose I don't consider it a large enough difference (compared to the total number), but that may be rather callous of me (it's certainly not an insignificant difference for those effected). And there are margins of error (unreported crimes, mislabeled crimes, differences in reporting methods, etc.), though whether this "helps" make the US look better or worse is obviously an unknown.

    Absolutely not my intention. Quite frankly its a shame that the statistics have/had been this way (the data is a few years old now, so it may have changed since). But the reason to bring it up is that it seems clear to me, that the difference in socio-economic disparity is still a driving factor here (though it doesn't of course rule out guns as another possible factor).
    iPox likes this.
  2. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi


    "So funding for basic gun violence research and data collection remains minuscule — the annual sum total for all gun violence research projects appears to be well under $5 million. A grant for a single study in areas like autism, cancer or HIV can be more than twice that much."

    "In 1996, lawmakers sympathetic to the NRA took the $2.6 million CDC had budgeted for firearm injury research and earmarked it for traumatic brain injury. Congressional Republicans also included language directing that no CDC injury research funding could go to research that might be used, in whole or in part, to advocate or promote gun control."

    "The field withered, with limited funding and not much new blood. In the last decade, funding for gun violence grew so tight that Dr. Garen Wintemute, a long-time gun violence researcher at the University of California at Davis, spent more than $1 million of his own money to keep different gun violence research projects going."


    I guess the fear is that if they do more research, something will be found that can be used to promote gun control, so it's best just to not let people research it at all. Keep everyone in the dark about the real impacts and use rhetoric and appeals to emotion instead.
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2015
  3. Ragic

    Ragic I need me some PIE!

    why not just repurpose some of the climate change funding? Those guys would happily find whatever result you wanted.
    DarkJello likes this.
  4. DarkJello

    DarkJello I need me some PIE!

    I wonder why scientists in other countries are not studying this matter? One would think that at least 1 billionaire somewhere would want to fund such a venture.
  5. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    Because gun advocates would (and do) say, "it's not the US, doesn't apply, the US is different."

    So basically, the tactic is "discredit any research that does happen and prevent US-based research."
  6. Ohmin

    Ohmin Forum Royalty

    I'd think pro-Control advocates within the US would be willing to fund such a study though. Though then I suppose it'd be an issue of conflict of interest as much as the NRA-sympathetic group being could be seen as being?
  7. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    Basically, yea. Like most political issues, you really can't prove anything because someone can just claim "bias" and dismiss anything you say or know.
    Ohmin likes this.
  8. Ohmin

    Ohmin Forum Royalty

    On a topically related tangent:

    3D Printers... they are a thing, and at least one company made some blueprints for 3D printers to be able to make (low durability) handguns. They also got in trouble with the US Federal government (since the blueprints could constitute international arms trade).

    But the point is, that could easily put a crimp in gun-control laws, and not just in the US. If and when 3D printers become more likely to be house-hold objects, what's the best way to deal with that sort of thing?

    Installed Hardware to prevent construction of certain things? Restricting 3D printers?

    It's an interesting new complication to this and many other issues... the existence of proto-Replicators.
  9. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

  10. Geressen

    Geressen Forum Royalty

    this is called american exceptionalism, wich is the idiotic belief that the US is in some way unique and diffirent than other countries.
  11. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    Eh, I mean, yes, that exists, but I do agree that not all research and data is applicable between different regions. Heck, even a study done in Cali might not apply in Texas.

    That said, most people I've seen who "it doesn't apply" don't really state any real reason why so it's largely used as a dismissal rather than an actual argument.
  12. Ohmin

    Ohmin Forum Royalty

    Aside from the cultural thing I've harped along (and the basic discussion of what causes high instances of violent crime above and beyond access to weaponry), there is a practical issue. According to Wikipedia, there's something like 116-ish guns per residence, by far being "number 1" in the proliferation of arms among residences. And I don't know that that includes unregistered/illegal weapons.

    Gun control might work when there are already relatively few guns (and relatively little arms manufacturing), but would it be effective when the region is already saturated?
  13. DarkJello

    DarkJello I need me some PIE!

    Family saves the day in Wenatchee, WA. As you can see from the article, the family was wise and brave. Heroes!


    WENATCHEE, Wash. - Wenatchee Police arrested a 27-year-old man Sunday after the man’s family discovered a threatening note with the names of seven potential victims, a handgun and several hundred rounds of ammunition.

    The note also indicated that Joshua B. Stuller, Wenatchee, had been stalking employees of Herring & Associates, a Wenatchee real estate rental and sales firm, to determine when and where they might be found, said Wenatchee Police Sgt. Jim West.

    “It was clear he had a plan to harm these people,” West said. “We feel that if the family didn’t do what they did to intervene, he definitely had the ability to carry out the threat. There is no doubt in our minds. It would have been horrible.”

    • Stuller’s mother told police that her son had previously lived in an apartment managed by Herring & Associates, and one of the employee’s voices was “stuck in his head and was telling him terrible things and he was unable to get it out.”
    • Stuller told his brother at a family gathering on Saturday that he loved him forever, and if he was dead, they would still be together.
    • On Sunday, Stuller’s stepfather decided to search the guesthouse where Stuller lives at 1419 Orchard St., and found a loaded handgun under the cushion of a chair. “He also found black boots, black gloves, a black hat, a black vest that holds magazines for firearms and a black ski mask out on the kitchen table. Next to this was a grocery bag with multiple empty magazines to an AK-47 type rifle.”
    • Stuller’s stepfather also found a note with the word “Communists,” and a list with seven names of Herring & Associates employees, along with the business’ address, phone number and hours of operation. Some of the employees’ names had an asterisk next to them, indicating, “9:30-10:45 am high profile targets likely in office.” Two or three names had the word “kill” next to them, along with a description of several vehicles. “The next four pages go on about annoyance, anger, rage, vengeance and an apparent list of problems Stuller is suffering from.”
    • The note also said, “The social impact of my retribution will no doubt lead to being labeled a lunatic who exploited my rights guaranteed to me by the 2nd Amendment.” …
  14. Geressen

    Geressen Forum Royalty

    stop devalueing that word.

    so the guy was crazy and able to get several guns... and he was arrested alive after the family got suspicious. so a fialure of us gun control and mental healthcare. not sure why you are posting this? usually you post pro-gun stuff.

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