IF we buy PoxNora....(Poll added)

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Bondman007, Jul 22, 2018.

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What should we do with PoxNora?

  1. Buy and preserve the game as is and attempt to fix it

  2. Buy the assets (art and name properties) but re-program the game entirely from scratch

  3. Let it die and wait for one of the Pox fans to clone it

Results are only viewable after voting.
  1. Bondman007

    Bondman007 I need me some PIE!

    Here is a serious discussion on what to actually do with PoxNora IF we purchase it. Please keep this thread to ideas that will actually HELP the game revive as much as possible and potentially gain new players and NOT crap like Icefang is OP. Ideas that will genuinely help the game survive. I will begin the thread with my ideas to give an example: (This is not in any particular order)

    1) Revive tournaments. The draft tourneys were pretty cool and I'm sure we could make them profitable again. (Hopefully)

    2) Introduce new variants to the game. I have two particular modes in mind...
    A) This will be akin to Commander in MTG (my personal favorite format). Each player begins with a super version of a hero champion from the faction (or split faction) of their choice. Then it is a highlander format (only one of each rune allowed) with a 40 rune deck. If the super hero dies its game over.

    B) Nora army format. In this format, each player is given a pool of Nora (say 700 for instance). No spells allowed. Relics and eqiupment are allowed. Then each player deploys champs, relics, and equips until they do not have enough nora to play anything. There will be ZERO nora generated throughout the match (including dropping nora globes). Win con: 1) Destroy opposing shrine or 2) destroy all opposing relics and champs.

    3) Introduce FACTION packs of cards. Either by wrath/protectorate (like original Pox) OR by each individual faction.

    4) Reintroduce the single rune store using PoxNora credits (not direct cash).

    5) Attempt to brand on sites like GOG.com, kongregate, ad banners, etc...

    Please keep this thread to these types of ideas not individual rune changes (unless that helps revival of the game somehow).
    Thanks,
    Bond
     
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2018
    yuore, Drache77, oyo97 and 1 other person like this.
  2. Etherielin

    Etherielin The Floof Cultist

    As someone who spent most of the time finding bugs and their reproduction steps for Pox, I'd say we focus on those first before introducing new blocks to the code. It'll make it easier to operate for the most part.

    Question from me though: what's the point of a single rune store if Rune Forge exists? Wouldn't it be better to use this idea along with the draft system, where the aforementioned system would reward you with latest expanion packs or let you draft cards from any expansion (and you get to keep them) with an entrance fee in form of gold?

    I've recently started playing Eternal Card Game and I'd say that offering the latest expansion's pack as first win of the day reward could also help everyone without applying the burden of a wallet on the game.

    Just thinking of options that revitalise the game without needing to use whales to do so.
     
    Fentum likes this.
  3. Bondman007

    Bondman007 I need me some PIE!

    These ideas are good, but we have to make sure the game is accessible as F2P BUT we ALL know it takes $$'s to run a game. We HAVE to make sure it generates money somehow.
    A single rune store could offer runes from LATEST expansion instead of having to buy packs to obtain them. It's all going to be a work in progress but a model to MAKE money certainly has to exist so that the game is self-sustainable.
     
  4. LoganMkv

    LoganMkv I need me some PIE!

    Not sure if everyone understands it, but if you buy pox as a whole package, you get poorly written unity client and working ok but still 10yo java game/web serverside - stuff very far from exciting to work on, and I bet barely extensible.
    So if they are asking for more than you can just throw away, I can recommend even considering it only if you can raise funds to develop all functionality from scratch with a fresh team, and at least same budget for marketing it - ie to go all in or nothing.
     
    Alakhami and Sealer0 like this.
  5. Bondman007

    Bondman007 I need me some PIE!

    Very big concern with several players. If you programmer guys don't think its feasible, then we'll watch the ship go down at the helm...
     
  6. Bondman007

    Bondman007 I need me some PIE!

    I did this work because several players thought we might could salvage it. If it doesn't look like anyone is willing to save it or that it looks worth saving then by all means we can end this discussion right here!
     
  7. LoganMkv

    LoganMkv I need me some PIE!

    Well, art/brand/community are definitely worth saving. I'm just warning that if you raise more than it's comfortable for a venture yet not enough to make it solid, it may turn out very disappointing.
     
  8. darklord48

    darklord48 Forum Royalty

    That may be worth looking into. Will they sell the IP instead of everything?
     
  9. poxrooster

    poxrooster The Pox Chameleon

    I'm interested in buying, but we need to be very smart. This game is not worth that much with the exception of the artwork. However, the artwork can be replaced and is only worth something if there's a market, which there isn't right now. It would make good business sense for them to reserve the artwork. The whole game is old code. No one has the time to redo it without payment. They're going to play hardball because they know people are "motivated" to buy.
     
  10. Bondman007

    Bondman007 I need me some PIE!

    Then maybe if we want to keep PoxNora as the name and IP then we just let it go to 404 error first THEN make them an offer? Course by then there be NO ONE left at DOG to communicate with. o_O
     
  11. Sealer0

    Sealer0 I need me some PIE!

    Poxnora has almost 30 expansions. That alone is enough to demotivate almost any new player to spend money on the game. Old players have almost every card in the game and don't need to buy cards.

    The client is so disastrously bad that I refuse to come back to the game at its current state.

    Want to get an influx of players? I have an idea, but I doubt many are gonna like it. Regardless:

    If it's even doable, fix the client. Remake it from scratch. It is an abomination, I've played many indie/niche games with bad clients and this one is just off putting.

    And, more importantly: fix the economy. Hell, make half or more of the runes free. Make all runes from pre - DoG era free. Getting runes for grinding single player does not work, single player sucks, the ai is non existant, and i doubt it is even possible to make a good ai for a game with so many variables. If you don't do that, you rely on getting whales for a game with no playerbase.

    If you make these changes, do an interview with for example rock paper shotgun or three moves ahead to advertize it. Stream it on Twitch, make tournaments. The only good mode for new players would be something like arena from hearthstone : draft mode/draft tournaments.

    And you know what? The game can still fail just because by now i bet many who tried it already see it as a cash grab, it is dated, and it has been rereleased on steam many times, without success. It has positive reviews, ffs!
     
  12. soulmilk

    soulmilk I need me some PIE!

    Regarding coding, we seemingly have 2 ways to go.
    1. Use old code and slowly improve it over time.
    2. Rewrite code in something like Unity.
    It might start out as number 1 and then become number 2 later on.
     
  13. soulmilk

    soulmilk I need me some PIE!

    I think a loot box subscription based system might be a good idea.
    Pay N every month and get a variety of stuff; Some packs, the month's unique LE skin, Nora Shards, Draft Tickets, Rename Tokens etc.
    Might even be possible to have different skins for the avatars.
    There could also be other benefits of subscription, like N% off Single Rune Store.
     
  14. Woffleet

    Woffleet I need me some PIE!

    Can reducing the overall damage present in the game particularly eliminating abilities that are situationaly powerful like flameburst or sources of damage like commander, battlemaster, Guardians Treasure exc be a major concern of this group? I just believe that changing the crazy damage scaling would have a major effect on this one round meta and change the feel of the game from this very swingy gank heavy state. I know this isn't a new feature but I think it'll go a long way to making the game feel more tactical.


    Also in terms of the massive rune pool and demotivating new players. Just slowly release each expansion on like a monthly basis or something specifically making sure that the design decisions limit ability bloat and complexity and the power level is stable.
     
  15. badgerale

    badgerale Warchief of Wrath

    I don't know much about the programming side, but assuming Gedden decided one day to give the game to the players and there was modest financial and programming support. If I was in charge, I'd:

    Remove half the runes. There are simply too many of them - all old runes disappear.

    Not put any effort into new game modes. There have been so many attempts at this over the years and none have been worth the effort. Single player as a training tool, ranked is the real game. Keep the playerbase in one place.

    Not change the client - yes it's Bane Shift but any effort to change it now is not going to be worth it.

    Focus on bug fixes, new expansions, new maps.
     
    Sealer0 likes this.
  16. Bondman007

    Bondman007 I need me some PIE!

    I like your ideas. Sweet, simple and to the point. But the question I have is...
    How does it make money? Continue selling new expansion runes and re-skins? Have the "mid-term" legendaries? Basically model the SOE system or what?
     
  17. badgerale

    badgerale Warchief of Wrath

    Expansions, and new players buying runes, you can do midterms though I'd probably make a slightly different format just for the sake of being different.

    Remember I would have dumped most existing runes so new runes will be more significant for the meta and people will want them.

    One of my biggest regrets when Gedden bought Pox is that he didn't take the perfect opportunity to retire old runes. People were all 'but ours themes won't work!', and 'my faction won't work without this crutch rune' which is true but that's what expansions are for - to fill out themes and develop factions.

    It would have been the perfect time to do it because Pox was presumed dead before and so nobody would feel they'd been shafted out of runes.
     
  18. davre

    davre The Benevolent Technofascist

    It won't make money. The only thing with any tangible value here is a generic fantasy IP and some art you might be able to flip.
    Gedden also had a vision to revitalize the game. Some parts of it were steps in the right direction, others were steps back. They had 2-4 people working full-time on this game for months at a time but they couldn't grow it. They couldn't maintain the population they started with.

    Ask yourself why things will be different for you, find examples and learn from them. DOG had several advantages you won't have (they owned the servers and had programmers and artists putting in sweat equity) and they still couldn't make it work.

    Good luck.
     
    badgerale likes this.
  19. badgerale

    badgerale Warchief of Wrath

    Yeah, pretty much. If perfect decisions were made in the DOG era I do think we could be looking at a sustainable game with a relatively stable population. Hell, even with the sequence of botch jobs people are still playing.

    But now, I don't think there is any money to be made. You're basically looking at sustaining it's existence without losing too much in the process.

    Which I might be interested in as an experience if it was given to me, but I wouldn't pay a lot of money to do.

    It would be like when virgin megastores decided to shut up and the management decided to buy it from Richard Branson. Which is great, they loved the place, but the reasons it wasn't viable didn't change and it only lasted a year.
     
  20. poxrooster

    poxrooster The Pox Chameleon

    The first changes I'd do if I owned this game is the following.

    1. I'd rewrite the base code to minimize bugs and stabilize the game. I'd fix bugs and champs and cut back on one rounding. I'd cut back the deck size to 20 - 24 and remove the 200 exp upgrade necessity on champ runes.

    2. I'd have a better rune manager complete with a complex search engine just like poxbase or poxpulse.

    3. I'd re-release it as Pox 2.0 Influx. I'd create two more lands on the general Poxanthuru map and detail the current map. I'd focus on storyline and racials to drive the direction. The new storyline would include absences where major or important characters would be eliminated from game play for a while until there epic return. We'd have movie shorts and story boards that brought out the storyline. We'd have a youtube (or similar) channel where we'd release a Poxnora Cartoon series that centers around "Tad the Boghopper and His Adventures in Forglar."

    4. I'd retouch the art to make it more PG-10 rated so that we can get a younger audience into the game.

    5. I'd focus on the single person AI. I'd get @Ballballer and @TinyDragon or similar experts in game play to create an AI on different levels.

    6. I'd create a similar funding engine to that of hearthstone to start and then change the funding engine as the playerbase changes.
     
    yuore likes this.

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