Patch Preview: Assorted Stuff

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Sokolov, Sep 24, 2016.

  1. 4NIK8

    4NIK8 I need me some PIE!

    @Sokolov While we are at it. Since everything is getting caps now (which is pretty healthy for the overall balance of the game). How about giving a cap to Drunken Revel. This thing is insane +3 dmg and +1 AP and it's pretty easy to trigger it. Very similar ability to the salaman ingenuity pre nerf.
     
  2. Pedeguerra

    Pedeguerra I need me some PIE!

    Buddy, you really need to step up your gameplay knowledge.
    Like, actually playtesting things on hour long matches instead of just assuming whats up.
    /facepalm

    Edit: by no means I'm trying to say that Illuminate should stay as it was, because I think it was too strong, it was just a point being made.
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2016
  3. phdstax

    phdstax Active Member

    You are right that, if you compared Illuminate to all nora gen abilities in Pox, that it would not be a main one in Pox. But if you compared Illuminate to all nora abilities in KF, that it was the main one for both Fairy and Elf themes, so you would be wrong.
     
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  4. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    Either way, I don't anticipate the change to impact the balance of those themes very much. It might cause @themacca to change his build somewhat, but I also think having a persistence duration Illuminate will also be beneficial, especially in the long run since now keying off the condition will be more reliable.

    My point regarding Illuminate is the following:
    • The nora generation aspect, from a design perspective, was never meant to be significant
    • Compared to actual nora gen abilities such as Nora Miner or a more similar ability like Essence Capture, Illuminated generates relatively little nora - heck, even something like Call to Arms compares favorably in terms of net nora benefits (and I would guess you don't think Call to Arms is amazing or anything)
    • The fact that numbers can stack up and be large over the course of a game does not mean that the ability itself is doing a lot of it
    And because of the above, I am not planning on adding a bunch of (significantly stronger) nora gen in KF.

    And yea, if I am wrong, and Illuminated is actually really good nora gen for some reason that is not discernible on paper relative to other nora gen abilities, then either way, good to nerf it :D

    This seems more applicable to you than me? Between the two of us, I am the one who is actually playing the game, and constantly immersed in many aspects of it, from playing, to watching, to designing, to discussing it with many players. You are the one who hasn't played seriously in years, constantly assuming you know what's up (which isn't to say you don't know what's up, and you are probably still a better player than me but between the two of us, you are the one assuming, by definition).
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2016
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  5. Markoth

    Markoth Lord Inquisitor

    [​IMG]
     
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  6. Darrkt

    Darrkt New Member

    I'm perfectly fine with the ability, but I was worried that empathy might have been affected without you saying anything about it. The first part of your statement reassures me that you were not planning on it.

    My doubt of empathy getting changed without being stated arose from your previous statement of:
    Reduce the decks ability to endlessly heal? Even though I'm new to this game, I have never seen someone look like they were endlessly healing with active healing abilities, ones that need AP to activate, like, Transfer life/ Heal Champion or Self/Heal Mass. On the other hand, passive healing abilities, ones that don't need AP to activate, like, Regeneration 1/2/3 and empathy would seem to give off the impression of endless healing. I might be wrong since I have not playtested my theory and I don't want to get accused of assuming.
     
  7. themacca

    themacca Master of Challenges

    I was kinda just running a basic aurora theme, (which now i wonder if its even meant to be a theme) so yeah it's probs a pretty big nerf to that. (though menalaus getting illuminate could help with that ;) )

    Finally you said it.
     
  8. themacca

    themacca Master of Challenges

    he's referring to decks like the SP meta, where you run a moga chef, mika, and g'hern sustainer and you just basically are able to heal all damage you take each and every turn cause theres just too much healing available
     
  9. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    So the thing is that currently, Healing generates significantly more value per AP than attacking. And this generally has to be true for healing to be worth anything. But DMG numbers are lower now than they used to be pre-DOG, and a well constructed deck can currently stall quite effectively just a couple of healing sources.
     
  10. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    I'd consider it a mechanical theme based on Blind/Illuminate and those kinds of trigger and not an "Aurora" theme. But personally, I think having Illuminate not consume itself will actually help this mechanic in the long-term, since, as you also noted, things like Hunter: Illuminated would actually make sense here.
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2016
  11. super71

    super71 I need me some PIE!

    Healing changes are gonna backfire big time, only a few champs were healing too much and should have been dealt with individually. Another global nerf that will make 100 champs worse.

    Also gonna make sl look like a god damn healing power house, look out regen ranks you will be nerfed next because nerfing all healing just buffed regen.

    Please don't put the nerfed healing through and nerf runes like sustainer, and other similar power healing runes.
     
  12. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    I am thinking it won't be too bad - as the cost of the abilities are coming down a bit, and Heal Champion is also going to RNG 5 instead of RNG 4 (as is tradition?).

    Rank 1 and 2 of Heal Champ is functionally being buffed (2 is not changing other than RNG 5 from 4), while Heal Champ 3 trades 1 CD for cost.
     
  13. Kampel

    Kampel I need me some PIE!

    [​IMG]
     
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  14. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    Guys... stop.
     
  15. Markoth

    Markoth Lord Inquisitor

    But you got me 4 (plus the 12 this well thought out post will generate) Likes...
     
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  16. poinl

    poinl I need me some PIE!

    The change in cool-downs based on rank is interesting. What are your opinions on changing ap costs based on rank?
     
  17. kalasle

    kalasle Forum Royalty

    The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing game devs to make their ideas public before launch.
     
    Kampel likes this.
  18. Pedeguerra

    Pedeguerra I need me some PIE!

    I was just giving you an advice man. If you say you watch/play enough games, then good for you and the game.
    But as pragmatic as you are, i was assuming that you analyze things on paper a heck of a lot more than the actual interactions, which i feel is bad for pox.
    But hey, just disregard the above if you think me not playing clouds my judgment on the issue.

    Are you finally a meaninful player or should i continue skipping your posts?
     
  19. eSmokefish

    eSmokefish Devotee of the Blood Owl

    As a scrub obsessed with Constructs, I am hella jelly. Where is Mason's RNG 3+ buff?

    ARE YOU WITH THE TREES?!
     
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  20. themacca

    themacca Master of Challenges

    are you?
     
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