Please

Discussion in 'Ironfist Stronghold' started by Firk, Jul 28, 2016.

  1. Firk

    Firk I need me some PIE!

    Remove radinat blow or explosive attack on Aspect of divinity. And lower damage to 10 speed to 5 and range 3-4. I love this unit.

    93 NOra................... i would use this if it cost asmuch as priest of valdac because he is probably a better chose for Divine favor and healing anyway.

    please do somthing about her

    Thank you
     
  2. Markoth

    Markoth Lord Inquisitor

    I actually agree with you. Don't know about that suggestion but she definitely needs some lovin. Radiant Blow is pretty sucky because the secondary effect is rarely relevant and just makes the ability more expensive.
     
  3. DrakeArron

    DrakeArron I need me some PIE!

    TBH, from what I hear, *all* of the aspects need some reworking, with the exception of the Violence one- thats the only one I ever see played heavily. I've onyl seen infinity and oblivion like, once before each aside from that. So, perhaps make this a general thread asking for reworking of almost all the aspects? IDK much, I'm a noob, but considering these things are supposed to be manifestations of gods I think all of them should be at least runable.

    Although, as far as divinity goes, I'd be fine if she had a basic attack that cost charges to use, but didn't have a cooldown. That alone would be enough for me, even if it replaced one of her other attacks.
     
  4. DrakeArron

    DrakeArron I need me some PIE!

    Also, props to you. This is *much* better thought out then your usual game balance change threads. In fact, personally I think your being a little *to* generous with its nerfs, even if its just so shes cheaper. Just as long as you don't make a new one every other day and keep making them like this I don't think you'll get anymore flak from people. Or at least, I'll defend you ;3.
     
  5. Markoth

    Markoth Lord Inquisitor

    Changes I would Suggest:

    #1.
    Immunity: Physical removed from Base.
    Phase Shift added to Base.


    This would lower the cost by 9 while retaining flavor. Also adds some nice utility since Incorporeal adds flying. Can be used to surprise contest side fonts. Flavor text mentions hovering in the sky.

    #2.
    Attack: Magic added to Base
    Range changed from 4-5 to 3-4
    Explosive Attack [Ranks 2 and 3] removed from U2
    U2 changed to Radiant Blow (Default), Explosive Attack [Rank: 1], Charged Attack


    One of the reasons Aspect is not competitive is that she is paying for range and damage that she can only use when things are off Cooldown. The abilities she has also have +1 AP modifiers meaning she effectively has Ponderous without the discount. This gives her an attack but lowers her range to 4 which makes her awkward until she Ascends. U2 keeps both of her former attack options (For historical purposes) and adds Charged Attack to give her something to do with charges after she ascends.

    #3.
    U1 changed to Divine Favor [Rank: 3], Heal Mass [Rank: 3], Heal Champion [Rank: 3]


    This change gives her the freedom to choose how to generate charges. Does she want the more expensive instant burst of charges from DF or does she want the utility of being able to charge later and multiple times from Heal Mass or Heal Champion.

    #4. - Minor Changes
    Class changed to Demi-God, Priest
    Ascended condition changed to (+3 Range, +2 Defense, +20 Health)


    The class change is so she can proc Branded from Mark of Al'Mara. The Ascended nerf is because the above changes would greatly increase her playability and a 70HP ranged 7 champion would be ridiculous. This leaves her as a 60HP unit (65 with Banner) which is still very strong but less crazy.
     
    DrakeArron likes this.
  6. Markoth

    Markoth Lord Inquisitor

    @Pedeguerra Mind giving me some constructive criticism of these changes? They are pretty extensive but to be fair Aspect likely has the blandest upgrade choices of any LEG rune.
     
  7. Firk

    Firk I need me some PIE!

    i like it, but i want her to do somthing real besides divine healing we got a bunch of those units allready
     
    aseryen likes this.
  8. Pedeguerra

    Pedeguerra I need me some PIE!

    Sure thing bud, I have some time before lunch. Let's see the current aspect:

    Base abilities:

    1) Ascendance: heck of a powerful ability. If you would sum up the cost on every ability it gives, + 3RNG, 2DEF and 30HP you'd probably end up with a pretty high up cost. Even without knowing I'm inclined to say the ability itself is probably undercosted, but we will see. Either way, this ability alone screams VERY powerful and anything done to this unit has to be with care due to this ability alone.
    2) Heal Charged: I feel all charging mechanics are broken and we would all be better off without them. My opinion. Pretty strong specially considering the faction it's in.
    3) Immunity physical: immunity to the most common damage in the game? Sure. So, just from her base abilities atm, I'm guessing this unit serves a role as a tank.
    4) Radiant blow: gives her the ability to attack from range and ocasionally CC the oponent. Situational at best. However, her base DMG at 12 +2 is nothing to overlook.

    Upgrade abitilies:

    U1: Divine Favor, 1/2/3. The problem here is that you really want to have the Aspect out as early as you can, since she will be tanking in the front lines and waiting to be ascended. Feels off at first glance. However, one can make a case that removing this upgrade line would remove the strategic aspect of playing this rune in the first place, because as is you have to sacrifice either: healing or momentum to deploy this rune, making it a careful deploy. I feel it should stay.
    U2: Explosive attack 1/2/3: kinda overlaps Radiant Blow, but at least it gives her the ability to not only serve as a roadblock.

    All in all, I feel the unit is well streamlined and designed, and I feel what keeps her from being played more is the high cost, even though she pays rather fairly for it (remember, Ascended is that good).

    Now, on to @Markoth suggestions, I feel the best one atm, which wouldnt really require a redesing of the rune, is #1. Keeps the same role she has atm (tank), makes her cheaper and for tanking purposes Immunity Physical isnt that much better than Phase Shift. Its also pretty flavorful I feel.
    On regards to the other suggestions:
    #2: I dont like this one because it starts shifting her role to a more beater one, and overlapping roles (tanks + beater) is something I think Pox should move away from.
    #3: same as the above, however the overlapping would be tank + supporter.
    #4: I think it starts opening up scenarios that could cause imbalances. Allowing synergies to runes is something we should strive for, but once the rune concept is created. Buffing to old runes to fit a new theme design, for example, should be done with care. In this particular scenario, I feel the nerf to Ascended is too minor as opposed to the benefits she would be getting from the class/race change.
    This is of course my personal opinion and I hope I could help a bit.
     
    Woffleet and DrakeArron like this.
  9. DrakeArron

    DrakeArron I need me some PIE!

    Question, what would think about, perhaps, makeing one of her attacks not have a cooldown (with the ap ncrease for each attack), however also make it cost charges? This way she doesn't sometimes sit around doing nothing for a turn, however, it also pseodo- nerfs her ascendence/heal charged. As if your useing your charges to attack, you might not have enough for ascendence.
     
  10. Pedeguerra

    Pedeguerra I need me some PIE!

    Well, as I said above I don't really like Charge mechanics so I personally wouldnt go that route, but I can sure see it as being a good option, since using the charges to attack leads to taking longer to Ascend. Nice.
     
    DrakeArron likes this.
  11. aseryen

    aseryen I need me some PIE!

    Granting her attack charged would also help keep her in line should charges stay and she gets reworked. Having attack charged already on her base line would tone done Mail of Barbs which is what she's just screaming for should she get reworked. Making either of her damaging abilities more frequent and leaving charges on her would be too much.

    Agree charges are a difficult mechanic to work with, either too efficient on the rune or lends itself to being replaced with another ability.

    Phase Shift on an Ascended unit with Mail of Barbs...Tales of Valor...surrounded by enduring aura and Bodyguarded by Northern Cross Militia...on Consecrated terrain...next to Heartstone with Grintmaw Hymn active and A Grintmaw Shaman backing her up...Make it a Campaign.

    Oh and a Sepulcher of Kings...
     
  12. DrakeArron

    DrakeArron I need me some PIE!

    This should be a contest. Come up with the most firked up combo you can think of- however it has to be legal, and it has to be FF or split faction.
     
  13. aseryen

    aseryen I need me some PIE!

    Idr which guild I was in but it was pretty active with contests. Brought out a lot of nifty tricks since there were rarity limitations and what not. Would be cool to see a shard limit contest, including current expansion (for the theory of the contest) and see what can be thought of.

    Have a contest rotating out each week exploring specific themes. Racial themes, attack dmg themes, class specific and so on.
    There is a lot that can be done in terms of contests it's just a matter of letting things settle.

    As far as Aspect's go, I would really be interested in seeing how they would be reworked. Avatars, Titans, Aspects and a few other rune releases are tied so much to that one faction that I'd really like to see something all Aspects share. Make something of Demi-God.
     

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