I quote from Zeventrech's rune: "I came to see this shattered kingdom, and despair. I have a story to tell, of lands once united. Sit, and listen." - Zeventrech, sole survivor of the Cyclops Empire Hmm, I wonder what THAT could mean? The "shattered kingdom" is obviously SP. "... lands once united." Well, the only lands that aren't united (at the time his rune was released at least) would be the lands of the Protectorate and Wrath... So... I don't understand your argument. It makes no sense according to the lore, and the lore is KING. The reason? Simply: It gives a guide and a reason for why things are the way they are. It's like history, anyone that ignores it repeats its mistakes. *Inner Strife: The Treefolk don't like the new elf reign that much, since the elves are killing them. Xulos betrayed Serkan. The Cyclops want their throne back. The Lonx and Yetis are being oppressed by the Jakei. The Skeezick are rebelling. The Underdepths are in a constant state of chaos (much like the middle east.... odd). The Darkmarsh and Mirefolk are at each others' throats. The Burning Crusade have been hinted to be burning "witches" throughout IS. *Cross Prot/Wrath alliances: The Skeezick are allying with the dwarves. D'elim seems to be allying himself with outcasts (aka: Nefari and possibly demons). Zeventrech allied himself with IS. Specifically the Barbarians. (hmm, the art for Bolt looks familiar...) Timothy the Vile. Need I say more? Also, the Snaptooth use dark magic, meaning that they likely have no problem with FW. In fact, I'd say the only faction that has stayed all by it's lonesome in terms of lore is the Savage Tundra. The Barbarian Bolt makes perfect sense as split faction. He shoots lightning bolts. Where did he learn to do that? Well, Zeventrech has been teaching people how to, and he was friends with Magnus. Seems straight forward to me. Also, I am fairly certain that IS was made from just Valdac, not Elsarin. In fact, some people theorize that those scantily clad human girls you see in FS runes are from Elsarin. It is closer to Elsarin than IS. Shall I go on? And no, I am not trying to be condescending (I just looked back up and realized it might sound that way), but your argument seems to be ignoring quite a bit.
Actually, there's a completely other, perfectly viable explanation for Barbarian Bolt being able to harness lightning. He's a freakin' shaman. Barbarians have a very tribal society, shamans were often attributed to being able to harness the elements, spirits, etc.
Zeventrux is talking about the literally broken cyclops lands that "shattered", literally, into pieces. Before the current era there was still war, Valdac made a nora nuke for goodness sake, as well as constantly fought with Elsari. HE was referencing way back before there was deep elfs or a ST, back when cyclops had a huge empire that spanned the world almost. He was also against the current SP faction and left it. He should clearly not be a SP rune right? All your iner strife "quotes" talk about inner faction issues not issues about runes switching sides in the global war. The only ones about IS reference one sect of the inquisition hunting down heretics with in the population, most likely the human population, which has elements from Elsari ( FW), who were witches before the cataclysm, well 2nd one that killed nearly everyone in Elsari and started mutating Valdac. I would have you go and read the actual lore and it might help clarify the issue you are having when it comes to this. There is zero reason for a linchpin theme/race unit to be a split just because it has a damage type you want. Bolt is a shaman, from the STORM CLAN, so of course he can harness electricity. It was an IS/FW thing before SP was even around. This is just the 2nd or 3rd time SP has begged for the bolt to be in their faction. None of those statements even begin to address split runes crossing alliance lines. At most they talk about inner faction issues that would keep said runes from working together with in the faction or at least working well together. You should also note, that in most if not all of these, even the "occupation" of some of the barbarian lands, it was a segment of KF, not the whole faction/faction leaders. Extremist so to speak. The skeez have been rebelling for years, and they had their racial changed to be skeez alliance instead so that it wasnt against its own faction. Which brings out the best IS/SL example of a cross alliance split rune. The half skeez. Its a semi cured but still tainted dwarf. It makes perfect sense for it to be played in both depending on which perspective you have on how much the cure was wanted/worked etc.
Actually there are just too many undeveloped themes in IS/SP, we've constructs: calcified lurker, overcharged golem, metallic slag. But three of em aren't viable post-revamp. Pre-revamp, metallic slag and lurker isn't meta-status. Then, when you see the synergy between Cyc Fesh, Armory, LRods, Bane Blast, you can see that there are things that can be synergized. I don't think there's any flavor in the BarbBolt splits, its purely out of the mentality to really tighten up split themes. Although I do think Ally: SP as one of the upgrade paths is a more convenient choice rather than splitting it. Same goes for SL/UD Fire amp.... Same goes for ST/FW Frost amp pre-revamp... While IS/FW do have electricity before SP, but SP was the faction given type: Electricity. If not, then what would you suggest SP has? That's mechanically speaking as to why SP gets Electricity. As for the flavor between SP IS... I myself cannot say much because its weird. But, when you think about it again, if we use your "we have to make a theme as long as lore and logic allows it", then SP wouldn't have any splits with anything. They're so trapped within their own selves. UD? Even "Cavernspawn" is pushing the limits. There's no backstory. Just a race/voil. FW? Zombies? SP doesn't have any benefits going with Zombies mechanically speaking. KF? I can't find any correlation. FS? Mogas have Swimming Lesson. Moga Team 6.But who would split Mogas? non Kanen SL? Mogas? Kanens w/ Cultural Contamination? Same argument who'd want to split Kanen/Moga and waste 2 spell slots just to make that split viable. ST? Probably Zeventrech, but even then ST doesn't have much to offer Cyclops racial I think its very hard to flavorfully make SP a good split faction because they themselves are so isolated compared to other factions. They story and lore of other factions are cross-intertwined, while SP's basically Zeventrech going off yolo by himself with not much lore-champ based synergies. Other than that, we have no intercorrelation with any other factions whatsoever. So by your way of choosing splits... SP shouldn't have split themes at all.
BattleMaster 3 is cheaper then Melee Specialist 2. Your pricing iis still a bit off, are you still working on ability pricing? Edit: Warchief is currently still bouncing even if other Warchief: Same Clan is out. I just had a Blood Clan bounce even with another Chieftain out.
That is what I meant by what I said. I just said it in a different way. Sorry for the confusion. Though, many Cyclops do see Zeven as the true leader of the Peaks, so it is necessary to some extent to have him be split with them. ... I was trying to be concise, and only bring up a few of the things that come to mind. And yes, the "inner strife" things mostly have to do with problems going on within factions, though some is between Prot factions or between Wrath factions. I was under the impression that the IS inquisition was originally founded to hunt mutants, and just happened to be good against undead as well. If you can point out some places where it gives evidence that Elsari people joined IS, I would aprecciate that, as I have read over pretty much everything and have never seen reason for it. However, it makes perfect sense for IS to be good against FW, since if they were originally Valdacian, they know how to fight them. I have. All of it. Several times. Not just the stories, but the runes as well. Okay, the Clans stuff, only exists as an ability. It has almost nothing to do with Lore, it is purely because people wanted a racial, and this was what DOG gave them. I am not really arguing that the Bolt be split with SP, since there is very little reason to make a split between IS and SP. If there were, it would make the most since to have it be this: IS inquisitors mixed with Zeven's loyalists. But there isn't nearly enough synergy to do that anyway, even though it is the most likely to happen according to Lore (as far as IS/SP is concerned). Yes, the Skeezick are the best representation of this. There are some runes that don't make sense, until you see the context or purpose. Like Dragon Engine, he is IS/SL. Makes very little sense why SL would make something like that (already have real dragons), until you realize that there are Skeezick that have joined IS. There are some things that don't make much sense, agreed. The Bolt is... Not the best idea, but also not the worst. Like I pointed out, it is a feasible idea that he learned how to harness lightning from Zeventrech. He doesn't have to have gotten it that way, but it makes more sense if he is going to be split with SP. *How about Hraken the Bloodbow? Absolutely no reason to be split, but he is. That irks me. *How about the Marsh Troll (I'm doing mainly IS splits right now)? He lives in the swamp. I guess people must have really wanted all trolls to be IS. "Why do the IS players get our Marsh Troll? There's barely any reason for him to be split!" Yes, you have a point, that doesn't mean you are completely right. How about some FS. *Corrupted Overlord... What? Why? Even with the Ichors, it didn't make much sense. *Mangleshell. Okay, honestly? Why is he spit with SL? Does he work with Draksar? Skeezick? Dragons? Maybe Kanen? No idea. How about some KF. *Ghost Stalker. He has spirit synergy sure, but is that really a reason for it? *Experimental Warspirit. Doesn't need to be split really. Just kinda is. I could do more, but I am sure you already know them. My point it this: There are plenty of reasons for Themes within Factions to fight each other, there are plenty of reasons for Factions on Prot or Wrath sides to do infighting (they barely don't most of the time, and now the elves under De'lim are warring with the Barbs), and there a plenty of reasons for Prot and Wrath to team up occasionally. Splits across Prot/Wrath are not that unreasonable. It just has to make sense lore wise. And the Bolt it actually one of the better spits (though not the best, obviously). To some extent, Zeven should be split IS/SP, not ST/SP. In short: It isn't perfect, so unless we can't find any reason for it to work, we should do our best to stop complaining. This goes for the people complaining for more splits.
I do not know this name, and have just gone looking through each of the stories. Care to give me a link? Also, looking through the things again, the only reference I see that might hint at some of the humans if IS being from Elsarin is when Magnus is talking to Isran (while he is controlled by Sarinda). He mentions that the world can be made like it used to be, using old Elsarin as an example. But that could just be because Sarinda is from Elsarin, not necessarily Magnus.
https://www.poxnora.com/info/story.do?i=23 Home page, game info, scroll down to The Pox Nora Story and enjoy. No Magnus isnt from Eslari, or at least I don't see it mentioned. Magnus is just from a clan in Sargnhavar known for its ability to tap into a blood rage. He and his sister were very respected barbarians at one time.
"Elsari and Valdaci both sought peace in the mountains." Ah. That one bit (and another, just a few sentences afterward), is what says it. I was just reading it yesterday, not sure how I missed it. That does, confuse me though. The humans at IS that were refugees (not the barbarians, I am fairly certain they come from a different lineage), they make up what is the IS inquisition. It seems as though there would be more in the runes themselves to indicate all of this... Hmm.
Nope, all humans are the barbarians. THis is what happens when 3-4 different groups develop a game and make up the lore as they go. Things get all muddled up. Originally, bcak when Pox was a game that people played instead of a war, IS was the upper crust of Valdac society and SL was the poor raggard people throwing a rebellion over their lo tin life, which caused them to change into dragons from a rage/emo curse after their leader was the first person to murder someone ( The IS representative who beat hi in negotiations about nora, aka a POX Battle). Then it was changed to an actual war between nations and Barbarians were the mountain folk who lived in the area where the run down IRONFIST stronghold was located that Rugaloth ran to after the taint and undead curse broke out. He took everyone not sick and who wanted to to the old Stronghold from ancient Dwarf history. Upon arriving, the dwarfs of Valdac allied with the Humans of the mountains to make a stand against the tainted and undead. A reaction from a War between Valdac and Elsari where a ancient magic rite cast by Elsari combined with a Nora Nuke to unleash the taint and turn Elsari to Undead. THEN, Valdac became a mixed Human/Dwarf kingdom that fled north after losing a war/being driven out by the Superior Draksar legions that they had repressed when they started to change from some "Blessing" from the Old Dragon pantheon that Valdac had/was turning away from. After the war with Elsari which unleashed the taint/undead ( at least this is consistent) Valdac, under rugaloth retreated north as the Tainted and undead fought each other and killed those who would not accept the blessing. The Humans from Elsari also made its way to the northern mountains and the humans joined together for survival founding Sarghavan, the last human city in the hills under the protection of the stronghold. This is why you have conflicting flavor texts AND lore issues from the stories as its been switched at least 3 times. As it stands now, after they fled north the humans built their city, and worked together to fight off the tainted and Undead. Elsari survivors are those who would not follow serkan or were running from magic run afoul. Those from Valdac are those who survived the taint and the draksar legions who followed Rugaloth north. IT would make some sense that after a cataclysm they would lose some semblance of their history and civilization and form a more tribal or primitive life style. Barbarians are just a class of warriors that favor more offensive skill sets then balanced ones imo.
The Cyclops Chieftan received a divine message from the Cyclops Seer that a Barbarian child will be found and will usher a new age of prosperity for his stuggling race. One day an Eager Cyclops was rummaging through the scorched remains of a Barbarian village after a Dragon raid. It seemed every Barbarian had either died or fled, except for a male child was found in the rubble unscathed. This had to be the child from the Seer's vision. This child was raised by the whole clan, learning their ways and to harness lightning by the Cyclops Snaman and Storm Callers, taught diplomacy from the Chieftan, so once he reaches manhood he can help form an alliance between the Cyclops tribes and the Barbarian tribes so they can stand together as one against the Dragons. When the time came for him to leave and tell his story to the Barbarian tribes, the Cyclops bid him farewell and gave him the name "Barbarian Bolt". He traveled to the Storm Caller tribe and explained the hospitality they showed him, he also showed them how much they have in common with their neighbors in the mountains and that they could form an alliance and together can defeat their arch-nemesis Dragons. They brought in the other Barbarian Tribes through the area and met up with the Cyclops Chieftan and they made the alliance official. They are now ready to face the Dragons and show them they are no longer to be harassed.
Ah, see, that's the problem. I haven't been around long enough to know this stuff. Perhaps you should go make a thread detailing the actual and correct (as far as possible) history of PoxNora lore? That would be handy, and interesting for lore junkies like me.
I love how this thread boiled down to a discussion of storyline. Instead of gameplay. Cross-faction splits would be awesome IMO. Screw lore. But first, fixed all the normal splits pls
But without a great background story aka lore, then this game would be lost in the other great strategy games. It gives it a sense of epic purpose and creates rivalries between faction loyalists, like how I'm a FW loyalist, and I hate IS lol.
