What about paladins/barbarians?

Discussion in 'Ironfist Stronghold' started by Aleswick, Mar 3, 2014.

  1. Baskitkase

    Baskitkase Forum Royalty

    Paladins are in a very good spot. The glue that makes the deck sing is the Attendant. Melee champs that really synergize well with the attendant are the CK and Magnus. We now have plenty of ranged paladins as well, the attendant gives them a melee attack on spot as well as anyone can get +3 dmg just for giggles, when they need it.

    I like to use as many paladin ranged as possible to get the most out of command. The only shamans that I use are the VWs, which I feel are vital autoincludes. I'll sometimes use bolts in times where Pygmie Stampede or Dark Rising (incredible instantaneous board presence) are problematic and commonly seen.
  2. xRugolth

    xRugolth The King of Potatoes

    Whoa dwarf are the heart and soul and the hammer and shield of the stronghold I have passion for barbs and I like paldin but dwarfs have my heart mind body and soul
  3. Tarth

    Tarth Devotee of the Blood Owl

    They are better off now then before. Savage was a lazy, over powered ability that held both the theme as a whole and the individual champs back from getting good synergy and actual good designs. What it sounds like is you miss the raw power of the ability when it worked, or the easy combos of touch+ savage, or savage+ blink, or valiant sac, etc.

    The only thing they should need right now is a walk through of their champ designs as that was more or less ignored after the savage change which left a lot of them under powered or over priced and with poor or lazy designs. Hopefully when DOG does their balance stuff they can give a once over on barbs and make them better champions.

    p.s. Incite was awesome! but godly broken in loads of interactions.
    blaahahaha likes this.
  4. Tarth

    Tarth Devotee of the Blood Owl

    So you think paladins should be a self sustaining class? Not trying to tear it down just interested if you don't consider them a part of the CTE/inquisition whole anymore?

    Personally would rather see priest/shaman fill the range role for CTE bgs leaving paladins to be front line fighters for the faith. However, its just my opinion, kinda a big fan of mutual need in design instead of stand alone options.
  5. Markoth

    Markoth Lord Inquisitor

    Listen to this guy. I personally don't use Squire (because I am crazy apparently) but they are incredibly efficient runes. Paladins greatest strength is the amazing synergy they have together. They all have small interactions and cool tricks that you can pull out like a Swiss Army knife.
  6. Markoth

    Markoth Lord Inquisitor

    Personally I would like to see the inquisition move more towards anti spell and magic mechanics and branch out from cte reliance. I recently reported an Inquisition champion that is a rogue that got decent reception. I wouldn't mind a bit of reclassification among the classes depending on a units primary role but Paladins are not restricted to melee and these class roles are not always the best fitting (see squire)
    Paladins - Combat
    Priest - Healing
    Shaman - Support
  7. Tarth

    Tarth Devotee of the Blood Owl

    I would agree that paladins do not have to be restricted to melee, same as barbarians not needing to be restricted to it or simple beater designs. I simply mean that paladins as a class are part of a CTE family that has one of the best defined roles/interactions with in its theme. I also agree that anti magic/spell ( maybe CC) is the perfect CTE mechanic roadway for them to go down, I just would hate for paladins to become a stand alone class that doesn't need its family.

    Oh and of course exemptions for any rule/restriction need to exist such as a pure support paladin, or combat priest etc. Just from my job, I've grown to really be a fan of synergy in terms of strong and weak point support. So I favor the idea of paladins ( throwing spears or shooting bows, hunting demons ala inquisitor slant to the paladin class) or priests ( assassinating for their faith, spying or even straight up brawling) and shamans ( calling on their god for increased power, casting combat magic, or simply hunting ghouls) as awesome and flavorful. Just not at the expense of the reason to run other classes.

    Edit: Can a paladin be a rogue? Just like paladins shouldn't be melee only, I think missing out on the chance for a shaman or priest to fill that rogue like role would be a shame as they could more easily fit it flavor wise imo
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2014
  8. Markoth

    Markoth Lord Inquisitor

    It wouldn't be a paladin. Just a rogue. What I was trying to say is I would like to see the Inquisition as a movement move away from a subset of paladins and more towards what it is, which is a fanatical movement hating what it views as evil.
  9. Tarth

    Tarth Devotee of the Blood Owl

    Deal. Sounds perfect to me. As long as its not PALADINS! and friends...sorta kinda, I'm happy.
  10. Markoth

    Markoth Lord Inquisitor

  11. Thbigchief

    Thbigchief I need me some PIE!

    - I think there could be sects that have the same goal as "archetype" paladins they just use different means. I always wanted to expand the "nightwatch" into a paladin-allied sect. Where they employ unsavory and not necessarily righteous actions but uphold the code and honor. It would be great for this group of shamans/mystics/rogue-like/mercenaries to fight for the cause "order of valdac" or whatever ...but this holy paladin committee would not recognize them as vocally as the goody goody inquisitors etc. Like how the vatican "allegedly" had covert death squads they used to handle things discreetly but would never admit it.

    "...to fight the dark you must know it...and even step into it" - someone cool
  12. Baskitkase

    Baskitkase Forum Royalty

    Tarth, @ your reply to my reply: I wasn't commenting on what paladins should be, just what they are. The reason I use/prefer all paladins is for two reasons: Attendant and Command: Paladin. Outside of that, the only real reasons to use all paladins would be Burning Crusade and Searing Touch (HBoV). Since HBoV is movable, that really doesn't hold much wait, since Burning Crusade isn't worth a slot, that holds no weight either.

    So, I prefer using paladins in my paladin deck for the 5/1 and the ability to use the Attendant ability on them. As you can see with my inclusion of VW, PoV and Sarge, that is certainly not a hard rule. It's simply how I play.

    What Markoth proposes is a cool idea, for paladins to be anti magic/spell stuffs. A cool ability for a furture paladin might be tied to the amount of paladins deployed or nearby.

    Paladins are far from a stand-alone theme, but they have everything that's needed for combat, and support can be placed anywhere, even at the loss of synergy.

    Responding to another item in this thread, I don't think paladins can be rogues. I think a paladin will always be valiant and loyal, honorable and chivalrous. We don't properly classify undead or fallen paladins, but most other games correctly terms them as Dark Knights, Shadowknights or something along those lines, and of course these former paladins do not show honor and chivalry but still loyal and even valiant to their master, who has replaced their fervor.

    I do, however, think that Priests can be rogues. Priests are going to be more political, more logical, more hierarchal, more corporate - if you will. I invite you to read the Nightwatch's flavortext.
  13. Tarth

    Tarth Devotee of the Blood Owl

    exactly!. That was one of the runes I was using as an example for priests and shamans to be made for CTE instead of paladins which seem to do everything. That and the squire which is a paladin yet purely support. Just more interested in making sure paladins need something other then more paladins! If that makes sense.
  14. Baskitkase

    Baskitkase Forum Royalty

    Keep in mind I'm just speaking on what would make sense, not what I really think paladins "need". TBH, I'm not too concerned about whats needed, out of shamans priests and paladins, I'll use what best fits into my 30 rune slots.

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