Why does ST and voil pay more for flying?

Flight is 6 nora while sonic/arctic flight are both 8. Even if you break them down you get:

Arctic flight - flying (6), res:frost 1(1) for a total of 7 nora

Sonic flight- flying(6), evasive 1(3), vuln:sonic(-3) for a total of 6 nora

Now this isn't even including the fact that neither give 2 ranks of sentry (Which is another 3 nora) like normal flight which means that arctic and sonic flight are 4 and 5 nora overcosted respectively. If we're paying for abilities why are things like these, hero and loyalty not paying for what they're actually giving you?


Edit: To clarify further since most people don't seem to get the point, either raise flight to 8 or decrease the other 2 to 6.

 

So you're saying Flight should cost 9

 

Actually it doesn't say(not sure if it's not WAI or just forgetfulness) but arctic is included so it would be 9 nora.

 

woah, so that's why I always felt Voil was a bit more expensive than when looking at other themes.
Fully support making Sonic Flight a bit cheaper.

 

no it isn't, the whole point of making arctic flight was to take the arctic bonus away from ST's flying units because it was deemed to be too strong. The only part of arctic that they kept was the immunity to chill/frozen which is worth something but there isn't a preset cost for that.

 

get rid of evasive from every voil and that will cut down your cost.

 

Can confirm that Arctic Flight gives Ready over Ice/Snow. Has been known for a while. Nobody cared yet.
http://forums.poxnora.desertowlgames.com/index.php?threads/arctic-flight.4500/

 

My guess is that they just copy pasted the code for arctic and added it onto arctic flight without modifying it which resulted in it gaining the ap unintentionally. And before we derail the thread even further let me state that I'm not saying they shouldn't nor do I think that arctic on a flying unit was an issue in itself.

 

Not meaning to derail anything. If they just forgot to mention that Ready On Ice is also part of Arctic Flight then ST isn't overpaying for Flying and everything is OK until somebody complains that ST isn't paying enough for flying.

 

And that's a fair point which would be accurate if it turns out that it was intended. However I'm under the impression that it wasn't which coupled with the fact that sonic flight is horrendously over costed spurred the decision to make this thread. If ST is supposed to get all the benefits from arctic then they should pay for it but I think the whole revamp is kinda pointless if we just assign random costs to runes without making them sensible. This extends to things like loyalty, titan, hero etc

 

Vuln:sonic is quite undercosted, and evasive is a really useful abillity.

 

So all this talk was to decide if I was right or not. I'm not counting it as an advantage (more like a problem in our faction) but atm I'm pretty much the only one finding bugs/weird patterns in ST so... At least Nebron can't say I don't exist anymore.

 

Flight should probably cost more across the board considering the game winning advantage it provides on some maps if you have it before your opponent.

Or just balance the maps.

 

People complain about abilities not being costed dinamically and yet in the moment they see a bundle they proceed to add the costs for each ability as if they didn't interact with each other.

 

It's dynamically and how does flight interact with these abilities in such a way that their cost should be this much higher? I could understand charging 2 nora as a convenience fee for having multiple things on one ability but 5 is unreasonable.

 

Break flying down and you get: Climb+Clear+Chasm Walker, or 3, 2 and 5 respectively.

Mountaineer is broken down into Climb and Clear which are 3 and 2, and then it costs 5.

Then for 1 more nora you get Flight.

I guess Mountaineer + Chasm Walker is a little better than flight though, since you can't be cliffed as a Chasm Walker - but I'm guessing we are woefully underestimating the ability to walk over chasms as a flyer when considering the cost of flight. There are other considerations such as things that only affect flyers (wind striker) and things that do not (such as Earthquake).

Flight is probably best costed at 8 or 9.

#SimpleAnalysisBeatsRandomnessEveryTime

 

part of it is the bundle, part of it is the themes they're in. flying is difficult to cost in comparison to most abilities (i'd say), and one of the breaking points of it is when you have more and more flying in your deck. like a deck full of flying units. those are just obnoxious to deal with in a balance sense

 

Great job, either you can't add or you failed to provide analysis leaving your conclusion up to assumption which also makes it worthless in an argument.

 

Vulnerability + damage reduction is the cost increasing interaction for sonic flight.
For arctic flight you are leaving aside "cannot be frozen or chilled"