I'm big fan of leoss like so many of you and I've been thinking: Is it possible to get some new leoss' in future expansions? or are something that will always have 20 possible champions (they are the ones with smallest amount of champions among the 4 split faction races)? Does anyone have info to share about that? Me and my friend have been fantasising about a possible "leoss king" sort of rune, of maybe smaller champion meant to turn the theme more dynamic.
Not so sure on all that, the split factions dont seem to be getting any love in the recent patches, altough new ones would be amazing. Guessing the large units for leoss are kinda their thing, would love to see a large ranged leoss tho.
Well, in my opinion, any decent ranged leoss would be awesome. But I would already be happy if they reduced the nora cost for the ones that already exist. Either way, I still hope they make new leoss and make the theme more varied.
The problem with making every theme have everything is making all the themes vanilla. More themes in my opinion need to be like the Skeezick, they have no detection so they rely on psuedo-detection to deal with stealth in a full race theme. Leoss have decent ranged options and while they are perhaps a little over-costed currently that too fits the Leoss theme so rather than reducing the nora, they should be brought up to the nora cost they currently have IMO. As for the Leoss King rune, to my knowledge there is no plans for it and he'd be a candidate for a hero and if that were the case you'd lose Mosharn and Hraken, part of the reason why I'd like to see them turn into their own faction so they might actually get specific magic, relics, equipment, and some more releases than they have been along with a specific faction bonus that could be used to tie them together. They could possibly make him a legendary release similar to Korona, Sixul, and the other old 150ks in that they were named. I doubt they'd release something like that since to be fair the stitched, kanen, and tortuns would need something too, then again 'fair' doesn't seem to matter, but a lone Leoss legendary would be pretty odd. As for the rune clearly a Lion, the real problem with the rune itself is that Magnate has regal presence already and to me that'd have to be a auto ability on the king since there's a precedent set already for it.
Yeah, I agree. Still, my main hope is to get new leoss' in new expansions of even relics and such made to agree with their game type, you know? I love leoss and because of it, I feel they could still invest in new runes not only for them, but for all 4 split champs. But hey, it's just a dream. Might as well instead invest in things like jellebrium, snaptooths, strigs, goblins and such.
I'm not saying not to want new Leoss, I'm saying let them keep their respective issues and strengths to keep them unique, I'd hate to see them end up like Elves, Demons, Undead, Dwarves, Voil, etc where they have absolutely everything available to them and a weak racial or no racial at all as the case may be. Like I said Skeezick with their flaw of having no detection are in a good place where pure themes should be IMO, so future releases of them should only give additional psuedo-detection not detection itself like the Leoss limiting their range options even with with future releases. At the same time the Leoss lack a lot of range, but they also lack healing and cheap cards, they went from being good in the beginning and being strong 1v1 to sort of a G'hern mechanic where they have to play off each other to sort of be worth their high cost. Given their playstyle and cost future releases of Leoss should give them a healer to keep the ones already on the feel alive, Divine Favor just doesn't cut it, splashing something for healing like I've seen in recommended "Leoss" groups like Priest of Valdac or Jakei Maiden isn't thematic, but they do need the healing option within their own theme, that's not a weakness a theme of high cost champions should have IMO. They could invest in all the splits, but you have to weigh the balance is it worth it from a development standpoint. Runes made for the full faction can be splashed in the generic groups, pure theme groups are in the minority since they have some sort of flaw and people care mostly about the win rather than winning with something you 'like' or rather risking the loss using something you 'like' instead of just using the best cards a faction has. Split faction runes don't seem to get much use even splashed where new releases of other races seem to atleast get 1 or 2 of them splashed in the meta. A little off-topic, but I don't care for the Jellebrium, IMO they're an off-shoot of the Firk being another psychic theme in Forglar and I feel Goblin should be either race: fae or spirit since they're a sub-set of such depending on which myths you want to go by, but there isn't really enough of them to even attempt a theme with them.
Well I mencioned Jellebrium and Goblin because I like the abilitites Jellebirum Mind and Goblin Thivery respectively. Both the abilities and the champs seem like something I would like to have fun with. Jellebrium are pretty much the only FS race I find interesting (ok, that and snaptooths), and Goblin would alow me to try something new in my main faction UD. Getting back to the point, I realize the fact that the leoss mostly need to be near each other to really be effective but I see it as something that is normal for IS. Do you think they should make another healer? or would fixing the druid be enough?
If you ask me Jellebrium Mind could be rebranded for the Firk and not because I'm against the Jellies, but the Firk don't actually have a racial and yet they're more established than the Jellies, I would consider it in the best interest to fade out the less established races/themes that have 12 cards with Jellebrium mind if you double up every single card, personally I could see the Jellies becoming Slags sharing their traits, it's not like they don't have themes that cross factions lines already such as the pretty universal Beast race and Constructs seem to be getting into SP as well hinting at more with the Ronin releases. Goblin's becoming Fae give them access to be ran with the other Fairies in K'thir and Goblins aren't exactly 'evil' in most myths so they could easily do a 180 faction change and make them K'thir Forest where they'd honestly be better off, then that'd open up access to other Fae that aren't just the winged fairies such as Gnomes, Brownies, Sprites, etc etc and people would prolly be better off for it since without looking it up I believe there are all of 2 goblins that have their 'racial' ability Goblin Thievery which hardly makes them an established race, but I digress and will probably make a topic dedicated to such once I get everything in order for it. They're not just IS they're a split so they shouldn't just have traits that one faction has if they're going to remain a split-race, from what I've seen the Tundra has more to do with them than IS does as suggested by Ailur Concord being a Savage Tundra spell not an Ironfist one and I dunno they seem similar to Lonx to me. It's not about their current racial though it's about how they started out to where they are now they did a complete 180 with their ability going from strong early game to a weak early game and they're not really spectacular mid or end game now, lets face it the high cost and group racial make them terrible early game and then you fight a losing battle the entire match where you can't keep up with your opponents far cheaper deploy and they have control over your ability entirely since they can just target a Soul or Pride champ to remove the effect of one or the other and that's stacked on all their other weaknesses so something needs to be done about that for them to be somewhat viable. (in the meta they're not the worst off race by any means) I think they do need a healer, a healer that is actually intended to be a healer, Leoss Magnate's Divine Favor costs Regal Presence and the Leoss Druid is needed to be a rare ranged option, he even has Pride over Soul to enforce he's really not the healing type, losing him as a ranged damage option and turning him into a real healer might cause the Leoss more harm than it does them good since without them they lose their only real (traditional) ranged option. The Jangar Arcanis can't pick up all the slack and the Leoss Magnate has a support role to fill currently plus 3-4 range is kind of meh considering he and Arcanis would be the only ones left to fill that void for the entire race. (I'm not counting the Chirai's Pin Down)
In regards to the jellies and the goblins I really can't agree with you. To me, the game can only gain by having more races then less with good racials. I mean, I'm a pretty recent player and I see it thought those eyes. To me, the fact they I have the possibility to create such original and varied types of creatures makes me more engaged in the game. Jellebriums are one such thing. I find the concept really cool (althought not all of them have a cool design) but it's mostly that completly alien ability that could only fit such an alien champ. As for goblins, sure, I bet in the original lore goblins might have been benign mystical critters, but I think what matters is what is in the general publics mind, and that is that goblins are tiny, ugly, mischiving beings. And that's what they are and could so fun. They could be like the fae (squishy but usally with tricks up their sleeve) but that place is already taken by imps. Which is tottally ok to my. Goblin Thivery an awesome ability that should be reviewd and explored further IMO. All the above to say one thing that everyone knows: loving a champ type makes you take on all the necessary losses in games. If you really do make that thread about this subject I'll try and find and discuss further.
Returning to subject, I always thought of Leoss as being more IS just because of their great defensive capability. But then again, I'm not very familiar with ST beacuse it's not at all my type of faction. Leoss are the only reason I even got into protectorate.
Different strokes, different folks, it's getting off topic so I'm not going to respond here. Same as the Jellebrium off topic, so I'll hold my tongue and address it elsewhere. It's going to be a novel of a starting post pretty much nobody will bother reading and I haven't decided to which forum to make the post yet since I want to comment on a number of races that aren't fleshed out. The problem is that to have a dedicated theme you really need the numbers to do it otherwise you're just splashing them in an otherwise meta group to use those items. They are more IS than IMO, but split none the less considering that Hraken is an IS/UD not a ST/UD too. Savage Tundra has defense capabilties through their faction bonus of increasing health and all that I'm just saying that they should have traits of both if they're going to remain a split race/theme.
Use the old racial IMO, the new KF is going to be based on number of champs deployed so they should be able to re-use that. Stat gains for that give diminishing returns when more Leoss are deployed, it'd restore their early game viability without a rework on their current racial also it'd play with the high nora cost, it'd lessen the impact of your opponent killing champs indirectly as reducing the number of champs on the field would give them all a stat boost. Not the exact numbers from the old racial, but maybe something: Full faction bonus: +4 dmg, +2 Def, +1 Spd when 1 friendly Leoss is deployed +3 dmg, +1 Def, when 2 friendly Leoss are deployed +3 dmg when 3 friendly Leoss are deployed +2 dmg when 4 friendly Leoss are deployed +1 dmg when 5 friendly Leoss are deployed No bonuses when 6+ friendly Leoss are deployed. Split faction bonus: +3 dmg, +2 def when 1 friendly champion is deployed +2 dmg, +1 def when 2 friendly champions are deployed +1 dmg when 3 friendly champions are deployed No bonuses when 4+ friendly champions are deployed Consider they're losing their Spell Resistance and +5 HP to get diminishing returns on a bonus it seems fair that a solitary Leoss goes back to being a viable threat effectively getting Pride and Soul size bonuses and the additional speed to help with early turn font capping as they don't have many 7+ Spds or even psuedo 7 speeds like Forglar has in some cheap bogs. Part of the complaints about the Leoss and the consideration of why they're 'difficult' to build for is their high stats coupled with the spell resistance removing that opens them up a bit granted this 'faction' ability would only work for Leoss, but honestly if you just make all the split factions their own faction with JUST those races included in the faction it doesn't seem like much of a problem, being their own faction would eliminate the problems with splashing them in a generic 'good stuff' group so you wouldn't have to design with that in mind, you could still split with Leoss faction, but it'd force you to use 15 Leoss cards rather than just picking over the few that are somewhat usable in standard groups and you could still use the Soul Bond units instead of those with Pride and Soul of Ailur as a splashable force along with some of the relics, equipment, spells, etc to make up the rest of the cards and considering the spells don't have to be super specific and all that doesn't seem like a poor trade-off when most groups just use 15-18 champions anyway there are enough non-racial leoss to 'splash'. I mention the Leoss specifically due to the threads nature, but it should work for the other splits which people tend to splash a few here and there and mostly ignore they could still do that, things that are used on occasion like the Tortun Land Cannon could easily be converted to a Tortun Faction card and they have a few more that they could take control of to force some diversity and make up the difference of a split with their faction, stitched and Kanen are much the same way.
