Faction Bonus Change

Discussion in 'K'Thir Forest' started by xezno, Jan 21, 2015.

  1. xezno

    xezno I need me some PIE!

    With what looks to be the inevitable change to our faction bonus (or all faction bonuses possibly), what do you feel is a suitable replacement at both the major level (only our bonus changes) or minor level (all faction bonuses being toned down). Here is Sok's post for all bonus changes:
    @Xirone brought up the excellent point that with the major change to all faction bonuses, ours and UDs would only affect a fraction of the champs and honestly we would get the least boost of any faction from this purposed bonus. So what are possible solutions to both the major and minor faction bonuses?
     
  2. Pedeguerra

    Pedeguerra I need me some PIE!

    Glad my idea is being taken into consideration. I also play KF and I think it fits the faction.
     
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  3. Xirone

    Xirone I need me some PIE!

    If spells are the way to go, maybe something along the lines of the following...

    FF- Friendly spells do +3 more damage
    SPLIT- Friendly spells do +1 more damage

    FF- Opposing spells cost +5 nora
    SPLIT- Opposing spells cost +2 nora

    FF- Friendly spells cost -5 nora
    SPLIT- Friendly spells cost -2 nora

    Note: Numbers are rough estimates, Sok and Co. could come up with the exact numbers.
     
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  4. Xirone

    Xirone I need me some PIE!

    I really don't like bonuses that only affect some champions. This includes the new proposed UD bonus.
     
  5. xezno

    xezno I need me some PIE!

    I love these ideas! It would also be a slight counter to IS bonus in some ways.
     
  6. Xirone

    Xirone I need me some PIE!

    Of these, the one that affects opposing spells is probably the most balanced (in my biased eyes) because you can't make a deck to abuse friendly spells. Again, Sok could come up with the numbers he thinks sounds right (+4/+1, +4/+2, +5/+2, +5/+3, +6/+2, +6/+3)
     
  7. Xirone

    Xirone I need me some PIE!

    Not to clutter this thread with warnings and provisos but I really do think it will be hard to find a bonus the KF players and the general population will both be happy with. We'll always want it it be a touch stronger than others would like and other will want it to be weaker than we would like.
     
  8. Poxbrothers

    Poxbrothers Devotee of the Blood Owl

    Repost:

    What about:

    FF KF: First attack per champion uses 1 AP less.
    Split KF: Second attack per champion uses 1 AP less.

    Or

    FF KF: Second attack per champion uses 2 AP less.
    Split KF: Second attack per champion uses 1 AP less.

    Gives KF a bigger threat range without having the instant font capture options.


    Sincerely,

    Josh753
     
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  9. Xirone

    Xirone I need me some PIE!

    I certainly wouldn't mind. The second one is much less poweful so that would probably be the one to go with.
     
  10. KPIC

    KPIC Devotee of the Blood Owl

    Just do +1 Speed every 2 rounds for FF
    +1 Speed every 3 for SF

    It slows us down a bit and keeps the calculations of champs mostly
     
  11. DarkJello

    DarkJello I need me some PIE!

    Every KF champ losing 1 speed AND not being able to save 1 more AP is a HUGE nerf!

    If every faction gets pounded into the ground, fine. Otherwise KF will go from good to terrible.

    Not sure which proposed new bonus I like more. Still processing... Yowzers!
     
  12. mw24

    mw24 I need me some PIE!

    this is true except kf is a lot more than just good atm. kf is pretty much godmode. playing kf right now almost gurantees a much higher than normal winrate.
     
  13. Xirone

    Xirone I need me some PIE!

    FF- Disengaging from an opposing champion costs 3 AP less. This effect triggers once per champion per turn.
    SPLIT- Disengaging from an opposing champion costs 1 AP less. This effect triggers once per champion per turn.

    Thoughts?
     
  14. xezno

    xezno I need me some PIE!

    I like the idea but only if this is for the version where all factions get toned down. By itself without any other adjustments to other factions, it could prove quite debilitating.
     
  15. Poxbrothers

    Poxbrothers Devotee of the Blood Owl

    I'm not really a fan of that idea, seeing as we currently have a fair amount of ways to get mobility if we want too and this is basically a weaker mobility.
     
  16. DarkJello

    DarkJello I need me some PIE!

    Are you talking about before the nerfs or after? Because a couple of days is not nearly enough time to know if KF is "godmode" yet. Get back to us with your opinion in 3-4 weeks. Thanks for your time. DJ.
     
  17. Xirone

    Xirone I need me some PIE!

    The first champion you disengage from costs 0 AP for movement instead of 1 AP that Mobility would give. If the champion were to have Mobility, on top of that, you would actually generate 2 AP by disengaging. Of course, the font bonus would have to change to something else.
     
  18. Gorebucket

    Gorebucket Forum Royalty

    I like these for exact reason provided at the end of his post.

    But just to toss out the maximum number of options to work with, I'll add another:

    Split: +1 AP cap to all friendly champions and +1 Damage to Ranged champions.
    Full: +2 AP cap to all friendly champions and +2 Damage to Ranged champions.


    This combines two of the alternative suggestions floating around in a way that splits evenly.
    Ranged champions being defined as those with a minimum range greater than 1 (as with bullseye).
    Melee champions can still benefit from the increased AP storage.

    EDIT: Alternately, the words "all friendly" can be replaced with "melee" if the bonus is deemed too much, but compared to the current one it doesn't seem like it would be. That option gives all champions comparable, but different benefits. Leastways, having a preplanned nerf option saves having to rework the bonus in light of actual performance.
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2015
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  19. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    Friendly champions with MIN RNG of 2 or more has +2 DMG, otherwise, they have +2 AP Cap.

    Hrm...
     
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  20. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    So what I like about it is that both melee and range get something. What I don't like is that +AP cap is one of those fundamental things about the game that I am not super keen on messing with generally. It's nice to have basic rules that are always true.
     
  21. Poxbrothers

    Poxbrothers Devotee of the Blood Owl

    I think it might just be me, but I generally don't like us getting damage for our faction bonus because it takes away what KF is in essence in my opinion.
    Speedy, tricky champs, that will kill you without you knowing how your champ died.
    "BUT THAT FAIRY ONLY HAD 30 HP AND 8 DMG, HOOOOOW?? NOOOO!! - Ragequit" Ya know.

    Another idea I had is:

    FF: After this champ uses a basic attack or ability which costs atleast 1 ap it gets hit and run for 2 spaces. This effect can only trigger once per champion per turn.
    Split: After this champ uses a basic attack or ability which costs atleast 1 ap it gets hit and run for 1 space. This effect can only trigger once per champion per turn.

    Added the 1 ap clause to prevent abuse from for example recharge, chanel: x, etc.

    It gives KF a bit more potential threat range or retreat options without having the fast font capture issue (which is honestly the only reason our faction bonus gets so much hate).


    Sincerely,

    Josh753
     

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