Why not give all runes +1 speed and make the bonus: FF every champ costs -6 nora to deploy. Split every champ costs -3 nora to deploy. Makes runes in KF effectivily 2 nora more expensive. From this point you can easily nerf heavy offenders. I know it's similar to SP, but our entire faction is based around that 1 extra speed.
I would have replied the same way to anyone making that comment - I simply disagree with the attack on Xirone's feedback especially since this entire thread's point is to provide feedback on such proposals. Don't take it personally.
I think the change will fulfill the intended goal and is a good fix. I just hope champions that rely on the +1 speed are looked and made playable before this change is made. Things like sprite and forest giant would become shoeboxed by these changes.
Sure thing, Sok. I dont, I just think Im on your nerves but it appears it isnt the case. Not to derail the thread: Cant remain with the SPD thing Poxbrothers, thats a consensus. Also, "base around that 1 extra speed" isnt really accurate, because frankly all factions could do with more 6SPDers and less 7SPDers.
I will certainly make an effort to do so, but no guarantees it'll be fully comprehensive, especially to start with.
Also, aside from the font bonus, Xirone does bring up a great point. It isn't really fair if one champion can negate an entire faction bonus. Even if it is only on 2 champs (both see plenty of play). Can't the issue be averted by simply stating that this AP is not subject to other champ abilities? This would stop the hard counter like blockade as well as things like punish and other things that I am forgetting.
It may or may not be easily doable, it depends on what options we currently have to generate AP, and also how exactly Blockade is preventing AP gain. But I definitely agree that Blockade stopping the bonus from working completely is pretty silly even if it's not common. Most of the other things, like Punish, is not really a problem because you have the opportunity to consume the AP before letting things like that have an impact.
I am ok with Rebuke also, it's more along the lines of Intimdating/Reflexes/Block mitigating part of UD's bonuses, or spells that generate terrain to do damage bypassing IS' bonus, etc. Tho to be honest, I am not sure if Rebuke would even trigger off faction bonuses, as it specifically states spells and abilities at present (which makes sense since the design wasn't intended to counter natural AP generation). Faction Bonuses may or may not be considered abilities for this purpose, we'll have to see.
If Unstoppable wouldn't counter Blockade, then definitely leave Mobility as the font bonus! I just don't like the idea, as Scrampy said, of a champion hard countering a bonus (Dread is probably the closest ability in the game that partially negates UD's bonus).
I have to further ask why Unstoppable is an option? It seems counter-intuitive to the idea of a fast, mobile faction. I can somewhat see the reasoning in regards to AP stealing abilities but, as Sok has said, the player has the option of burning off the extra AP Edit:/ Ninja'd . I agree that Blockade clocking off an entire faction bonus is... iffy, but the champion's who have the ability are somewhat limited.
The difference to me with this is that intimidating, reflexes, and block are effective against every faction. Same with dread. When we see a unit come into play with acid greeting come into play we do not consider it a counter to the ST bonus because it is equally effective against all factions. With the faction change rebuke would be clearly much stronger against KF than other factions. Not only that but other factions can play around it (not invigorating, mobilizing, etc.) where as we would either have to alter where we are deploying or suffer slight damage. To me it is more it is more like things like nora leech effecting the FS bonus or resonance effecting the FS or SP bonuses.
Another simplified version of one of my earlier posts. FF: Champion gains 1 ap the first time it spends ap outside of direct movement each turn. +1 ap cap. Split: Champion gains 1 ap the second time it spends ap outside of direct movement each turn. +1 ap cap.
The internet courage is stronK with this one. Edit: They made up. Equal congrats to both. Thead is super interesting. Carry on please.
What if the bonus looked like this: FF: When a Champion successfully attacks an opposing unit it gains +1spd for 3 turns. This effect can only trigger once per turn. Units deployed from the rune dock receive +2AP for every 3 champions in play to a maximum of 4AP. Units that gain AP on deploy are not effected. Split: Units deployed from the rune dock receive +1AP for every 3 real champions in play to a maximum of 2AP. Units that gain AP on deploy are not effected. This would require champions to obtain there +1spd and not completely screw up the early game, as for Splits this would potential give an actual reason outside of Grimlic's Mirror to be splitting with KF. --- Regarding champions that don't have attacks, IMO; I don't think they'll be needing the +1spd if they're supporting. Obviously +1spd would be given out in some cases. But as far as the general support champ, I don't think they need to be that speedy to be effective. I think it's worth noting that KF champs have a lower natural speed in some areas, where the nora was distributed amongst other stats to insure a champions raw Nora cost wasn't to low. Which kinda goes without saying in most circumstances; but I think KF's champions are generally made with the bonus in mind, and removing +1permaspd would result in the majority of KF champions under-performing in combat with exception of our 7spd's/High Ranged units. Last
Which I think, for me, is the BEST reason for changing the bonus. It literally is a strange thing that the "fast" faction is actually the one that has, on base, more non-SPD stats and the bonus literally enforces this paradigm.
What about: FF: If you deploy a real champion from the rune dock friendly champions within X spaces gain 1 AP, where X is twice the amount of real enemy champions. +1 AP cap. Split: If you deploy a real champion from the rune dock friendly champions within Y spaces gain 1 AP, where Y is the amount of real enemy champions. +1 AP cap.
