Yeah, unfortunately smurfing is a huge issue for DOTA, but I guess that's just the trade off of a no unlock system. When I went in, I went in with a bunch of buddies and got taught, I didn't go in dry.
When you say shop organization I'm assuming that you mean multiple shops, this is done largely for game balance. If you want X item you need to stop doing Y activity or deny the rest of your team the courier until you get your item, everything is a choice between one thing or another. On the "everything thrown at me" kinda thing, there is a limited hero que with only 20 heroes included, just FYI.
I think there's a "limited" mode to queue for that gives you a reduced pool of heroes to play with (and ones with the simpler mechanics). Also I agree with you on the production for the streams - LoL's is a lot more corporate, trying to be very e-sports. Dota's casting is a lot more laid back in general (although you will see TI4 will be more similar to LCS in terms of production, as it's the only valve run event, most of the others are ran by the community) Love playing both games, but only like watching dota. Tried watching an LCS game or 2 again the other day, was not surprised to see a 30+ minute game with a total of ~10 or less kills.
In Dota you can watch games from inside the client, and follow certain players' mouse and camera movements, while still tuning in to audio feed of the casters in-client if you want (not sure if you can do this on LoL). And the few times I watched a league of legends draft phase with commentary it seemed like none of the caster had a clue about who was good vs who and why, and no good insight in overall game strategy from the first few picks (could have very well been bad luck though), making it seem like there is less depth to the game. I play LoL sometimes but I'm like level 15ish and the rune page bs really hurts the enjoyment of my "progress" (oh I can almost unlock Ahri! but then I'll have no runes when I hit 30..... (25?))
When I get my keyboard fixed/replaced/worked around or otherwise I'll give another look into the Limited queue. I don't recall if that was something that was obvious for me from the get go. For LoL, I usually enjoy watching the OGN streams with Montecristo, Chobra, or Doa, the production Value of the OGN is still quite high (given the Korean backing for E-Sports and all) and the quality of the games are also high as well. I don't mind a low kill game if there is a high planning, there have been many games with less than 10 kills but both teams were playing quite well. But yeah, the pick/ban phase is a lot better in captain's mode in DotA than it is in League of Legends. With LoL only having 3 bans per team and they are all up front as well with most characters having a relatively pre-defined role, there isn't as much of the mind-gaming in terms of team drafting, though it's slowly being expanded. Runes make a difference, but you will start unlocking the T3 ones at level 20. Honestly, they matter, but until you hit level 21, they really don't. With the progression, though, I mean, there are still smurfs which can sometimes damage gameplay, but at the same time, because of amount of investment it takes to level up to level 30 and unlock runes and champions, I feel as though it does discourage smurfing to a degree.
It also discourages my dota playing friends from trying LoL, or me talking new people into trying LoL over dota. :/
I don't understand, since there is a level of progression where you are much more slowly introduced into the game, they are discouraged from trying out the game? I mean, you start off for the most part getting introduced with bots, just like DotA, and then the low level games are low level games. *shrugs* It would be incredibly punishing to push players into ranked right from the get go, especially with the number of players that we have, it allows you to really take the time to get used to the game before you commit to ranked. Even then, most people once they hit level 30 should not immediately jump into ranked, but play a few more games beyond that since their skills probably still won't be up to par.
Well for existing dota players that amount of 'forced' learning is kind of embarrassing, and it becomes a grind where they aren't learning anything. Also for my friends they aren't able to play with me in LoL very easily without a crapload of time investment, whereas in dota it's no problem at all. (also not being able to unlock content, etc). The fact my friends are generally "good" at games makes this slightly biased as they don't feel they need such extreme training wheels.
Then they can still join in and play group games and/or dominate their own lower levels. There's still going to be a transition period between the games and I'd be surprised if there wasn't really anything to learn. I hear people complain all of the time in LoL from DotA players saying that players can't play, but LoL relies much more on your team whereas in DotA I feel it is much easier to solo-carry. I play all of the time with low level players and on low level accounts with friends in NA, Europe, and Oceania and I'm still able to enjoy it. With that said, in almost every game and environment I've been a part of, when you feel like you know absolutely everything is dangerous, there's still a lot to learn no matter where you are in what game. If you feel there isn't anything to teach you, that's when a lot of people fail and get frustrated, from an academic and general perspective. I understand it is a grind, I have some smurfs that I am raising up and it is definitely taking a while though I really enjoyed the first time I ran through the game, it took me a while to level 30 but the progression was fine for me and even today I don't play ranked because I don't feel like I've learned enough and am skilled enough yet to be where I want to be in ranked. I'm not sure what the compromise can be, maybe Riot will enter in a fully customizable sandbox mode, but I enjoy the process of working towards and unlocking a character, unlocking runes, leveling up. I invested time and energy and I get rewarded for it, I earned my characters, my runes. But I guess that feeling isn't for everyone.
Wat. Everything else you said I get, I've played a bit of LoL myself and really quite enjoyed it, but this is so, so wrong. After around 1500 hours and almost 1200 games, this is just wrong. The amount of room for a one core carry team that the supports/offlaner need to make is ridiculous. Once you get past the 50 game mark where theres a Riki, Drow and Sniper in every game this is just false. The amount of effort it takes to get a strong single core hero to its peak is just silly, almost impossible in the current meta, any team worth their salt will gank the Bane Shift out of a Solo carry Medusa/AM etc.
Perhaps, reading back over it I see what you mean, but regardless once you get out of a certain skill tier, you simply cannot solo carry the game. The only way this works is if your playing against a team who doesn't know what they're doing. Each member of the team has a very specific role they fill, even if that role is a flexible laner. In a 1:1 stand off, if one person gets picked off, even if it's a #5 support like Crystal Maiden, its pretty much the enemies game if the one man down team chooses to engage. The situation just doesn't arise of a solo man carry unless the enemy team is full of duds.
I was watching some Lol tourney this weekend. I dont know how 200k people can watch it whitout becoming bored. Less than 1 kill per minute, passive farming and "skilled" flashes everytime a gank or a fight happens. Watching this after playing Dota for 2.5 years was like trying to intentionaly become stupid.
Because they love playing the game (which is fun), and it's the top level of that game. Same reason why football fans can enjoy watching a boring 0-0 game, because they are emotionally invested. Still, i'm obviously in agreement with you. It's so Bane Shift-boring when you are into dota as well.
When I play LoL with level 30 friends and everyone else has maxed out rune pages it feels VERY VERY unfair. Problem with runes imo are 2 things: feels punishing to get champions since you need the IP for runes to be on a similar footing with other players, and like I said it is not a choice you can make. You can't decide to "play for real now". Experience is the best teacher. Ofcourse you are going to be in a disadvantage on skill, but why do you have to be in a disadvantage in stats?
