trying to make a Witch or Spirit BG i would find even remotely fun to play and fitting in the theme I think they should be. Then I gave up. Trying to make a Stealth/Debuff centered Spirit BG is impossible. Witches with Coven as an upgrade on so many of them is a nightmare, central champions has lost their defining role and cost on them is through the roof. Then add insult to injury that some of the witchs does not even have Elsari Coven on base or as upgrade :O At the same time Cost for a lot of upgrades is headshakingly weird. But then again virtually all prices seems incredibly wrong and weird. How is Magical Attack more expensive than Curse? Who in their right mind would ever take Curse 1 on (the still wrongly named) Elsari Swordmage when you can make him 1 nora cheaper with Magical attack instead? Archfiend. Why is it a Witch? Cackling: I dont get the Hex upgrade line. It doesnt really fit her. Other than that she (price sems hight though but all prices seems weird) looks sort of ok. Dark Enchantres Why is Coven an upgrade and how expensive it is? It seems really overcosted and it wrecks the theme. Dark Enchantress I dont get the upgrade list with Hex again. She is a sneaing harraser and her one upgrade path supports it. the other does as well to a degree, but having an activated ability attack taht breaks stealth seems counter intuitive. Elder Bloodbinder Why is it a Witch? And has anyone thought about Vampires in conjunction with Witching Hour? Elsari Siren. I sund like a broken record, but why witch? Flavour speaks of Necromantic symbols and she is an undead Mirefolk. Witch seems very off. Elsary Swordmage (Why not Swordwitch) Who in their right mind would take Curse over Magical Attack when Magical attack is cheaper, grants an alternate damage form and does full damage? Warspirit Looks runable and intereting for the first time ever. (But again. Coven ffs its should be mandatory on all Witches in FW) Fleshweaver Reconstruct Stitched?????WTF and why? It looks fine and dandy for Zombies still, but I cant see it fit intoa Witch theme at all. Forskane follower Once again forsaken. Her redeeming qualities was healing high HP ratio and a ok damage ranged attack. She now has neither of those. Frostvein I dont understand why the upgrade path is not: Chill 1, Chill 2, Snowblast. and DEbilitae, Drudgery, Blockade. It would make far more sense to have her ice in one path and her AP/Speed effect in another. She looks okish, but her HP ratio is so low I am balking at it. Inkblight? Why is she sandbagged with Curse as her entire upgrade path 1? It is not an upgrade anyone would or should ever take. She was iconic with Blind (and it fits her name) but again Coven or Blind. Coven as an ability might as well not exist when it is not on them all (or at leas the vast majority) as a base ability. Mysian Lamia Why a witch again again again? Why Soul Collection (Why step on the Bokors toes?) Why the range 2-4 and why the horribly high cost? Near 100 for a range 4 champion? Mind is blown. Mysian Necromancer? And another Why a witch? No sense at all Necromancer WaW again. Rip Piecing shot is a boring and sandbagged upgrade path. With Deep Wounds it is far more importent to make additional basic attacks to stack Deep Wounds.Wasting AP on Piercing is not a good idea. Sarinda Seems very expensive and Dark Healing is still pretty bad. Stitched (all of them) WaW Bokor Come on, give him Coven at base please .Who would ever take Coven over Soul Collection. His whole thing was Cursed Treasure with Soul collection. Wretched Witch. She was the first champion ever with Wicked Aura. It was her trademark and you took it off? Then to add insult to injury she was sandbagged with 8 damage to driver her cost up (no basic attack to use the damage) I really hope its a mistake.
You really could have put this together better, though I agree with most of what you're saying. I'm fine with things being less powerful, but the changes all seem like shots in the dark. It's almost guaranteed that it will be fixed in time, but as it is, most FW champs seem random and hobbled.
FF witches haven't ever been my thing, but I can assure you that in splits they suck as much. Fleshweaver with recon is actually cool, she stitches, and stitched-zombie mix is viable. Random witches are also present in other factions — like crones, headshrinker, or poor poor DES (she is not a wizard anymore, so no CD1 invig). It seems to be just flavor, like demonologist and magus are vamps now for also no reason. I don't know if anyone wants frostvein without drudgery and blockade, I definitely don't. Bokor - facepalm. Warspirit was a key for KF/elfwitches, and even though his nerf is not as big, he wasn't really good at the first place.
Basically my opinion on the revamp is what Baskitkase posted earlier in general. A lot of themes and bgs were broken by the revamp, and it should be a priority to rebuild synergies and make coherent themes.
Frosty by far was 1 of my all time favorites - the true support with drudgery and blockade, snow blast was a good add - now she is just a puddle in my heart if she gets blockade back don't put it in the sane ability list as drudgery
Yes with her damage @ 11 and chill 2 was respectable but unless you were running a witch build, whereas you had 2, you would use her more as a combatant. Its in those other builds is where she became support, when you cant lose that blockade due to all the ini champs and drudgery to stop the rush. in all my builds when ever she showed in the rune dock she was played that turn
No..... so what you are saying is that if there is rune that you like and has the capabilities that helps you in a contest it needs to be changed? As well in any of the builds, you have made, at least 1 of same champion is not in most if not all of them? shenanigans
He makes a fair point. There's nothing broken about counter-play. I can see taking Drudgery off, but Blockade is kind of essential in some situations.
By the statement that both of you have made this revamp was the right thing and stop complaining about the changes
No, what you said is that you'd play her whenever you revealed her because she's that good. That's a problem if it is true.
how is that a problem? if Serk was available would you play him? the idea is to get the rune out that will most benefit your build frosty happened to be mine
to stop/slow the advancement of any opponent in order to get the stronger more "combat ready" champion out , to change the tide of battle, this is what a good support does - For me Frosty was that 1 -
It's too early to even say. The last meta evolved over a long period of time, and the revamp has only been out for a couple days. Try new things, experiment.
