Name subject to change. This BG is a continuation of my attempts to make a SL/X split that gives me access to Stun and plays out the way I want it to. I have previously tried IS/SL, ST/SL, SP/SL (and even IS/ST). I realized that part of the problem may have been the lack of a certain form of on-demand Stun (like Oaken Mace for example) combined with swiftness/speed/mobility. So I decided to try a KF/SL split. After building and rebuilding the BG multiple times (strictly on paper so far), I have arrived at this: http://poxbase.com/#!/deck/cogcwvc8...4cdmc1jcoQs2@s84s1as73s7us4Ks6gs5jr2or2qe22e8 I aim to make use of Skywing Beacons and general speed/swiftness and relocating abilities to get where I want and punch who I want. The Stun is there to ensure I get to do that, without my targets running away or other stuff getting in my way, but most importantly, it is there because I want it to be there. The BG is also meant to have a certain flexibility/adaptability to various combat situations. It is meant to play out somewhat agressively, based on the belief that the best way to win is to crush the other guy's champions to protect yourself and be able to move forward. The cards that are meant to stay in the BG no matter what are: Basilisk Templar, Garu Kodiak, Skywing Patrol, Draksar Berserker (on which I take both Reinforcement and Initiative), Nectar Fairy/Sprite and Oaken Mace. Time Slip, Draksar Broodqueen and Mountain Garu/Skywing Rumbler are close to being considered unreplaceable as well. Out of the following, I believe I should have at least 1 of each, one way or another: - Draksar Bookburner/Conclave Warden (I feel I can't really go without anti-spell) - Acid Storm/Nature's Wrath - Quicken/Transfusion/Draconic Benediction - Wizard of the Ways/Elven Strategist Initially, I avoided adding a second Garu Kodiak due to its nora cost, opting to use Myx Adamant to fill a similar role. However, once I decided I'd be using Basilisk Templar with Crushing Charge no matter how noobish that may be, I felt the need to search for another source of Punishing Aura/Punish and I ended up adding Draksar Marauder. After that, I realized that a second Garu Kodiak could replace both the Adamant and the Marauder, giving me an extra slot. Occuli Slag was included due to Nora Miner, but the alt damage, Premonition, Detection and especially the Gift of Scrying are also nice (dayum this Rune is useful). I consider Sprite to be better than Nectar Fairy for what I want but I replaced one Sprite because I used to have Protection in the BG and Favor 'gave it away'. Even though I no longer have Protection, I decided to keep Nectar Fairy due to the heal. The Bloodthirsty Blade is there because it works nicely with Garu Kodiak and because it gives me Multiattack while at the same time being a source of champion protection. I always try to add at least 2 sources of champion protection in my BGs: one that absorbs/nulifies damage (like the Bloodthirsty Blade) and one that makes attacks miss/never happen, in order to avoid Loss of Life (a role filled by Reclaim in here). Serpentor Paradigm is there because I want damage (of which he offers in the non-physical variety) and he's awesome with Bloodthirsty Blade. At the end of the day, I was left with 1 KF slot free. I thought about adding: a second Nature's Wrath, Burning Oak Seed, Cleansing Emerald (because I didn't get to add Legion Standard and I have no source of Prestige, I considered that having 2 sources of cleanse -1 of them with dispell- might be appropriate), Protection and Ancestral Anger. I eventually decided to include Combined Effort to see how that works out; perhaps it can compensate for having more expensive champions. I have also felt that the Artillery Marker could potentially be replaced by one of the Runes previously mentioned (even though it's so good). I also wish I could have added Tortalleon Pygmy (Combo Attack: Devastate) and Privateer Captain seems like it would've been nice in here. Just for reference, here is the very first version I built: http://poxbase.com/#!/deck/cogcwvc8...4cdmc1jcoQsasks84s1as5Ws73s7us6gr2or2qeWe2Ie8 The Grimlic's Mirror was added in there because I was pissed off thinking there was no way I'd be able to get 2x Garu Kodiak (no longer the case).
Possibly, which is why I considered having Sundered Hellion as well, but I didn't quite manage to have enough room. I -might- also come back to using Punishing Aura on the Basilisk Templar, but at the moment, I just wanna run him with the upgrades that I like (even though I'm gonna miss PA's power now that I'm used to it). Any more advice? Regarding this or the BG in general?
Why not perfected runner instead of mountain garu? With rumbler and runners you will have a sort of death benefit module that you could flesh out with a ghost stalker or negamage.
Bowmage for CA: Slam. 2 Draksar Berserker + 2 Skywing Patrol. Berserker is just so good with/without the Beacon. thus, Bowmage + Quicken + Mine Field = godlike Protection is quite important against certain matchups, Cleansing Eme should be kept to 1.
These are nice suggestions and are definitely things to try out in the future, if not in the 'main version', then at the very least for alternate ones. My reluctance in trying them out now comes from the fear that these changes might steer the deck away from what I like doing. For example, Bowmage is a definite must try, but Mine Field is a spell that I don't particularily want or enjoy. And what would I take out to make room for it? Yes, I'm aware the combo is good, but there are many good combos out there. The Death Bene module suggestion is interesting. Negamage could potentially be added in the slot Bookburner is occupying now, but the Counterspell Mastery is much harder to control (I don't wanna give up anti-spell completely) and it charges quite slow (as it stands, I wouldn't be able to take Death Charged 2). I'd rather try it the other way, with Stalker because I have more wiggle room on the KF side. However, I'm concerned that this pushes focus too much towards fragile creatures and away from the beater types I enjoy. In the meantime, I tested this deck out and I want to talk about that. I seemed to have trouble with Ranged units and generally getting close to them through the rain of projectiles, so to speak. I also encountered some trouble with Fear/Horrific Aura and Intimidating champions. In an attempt to somewhat fix things, I added Legion Standard instead of Combined Effort and swapped Bookburner for Conclave Warden. Since then I haven't gotten to use the Standard for Prestige and it hasn't helped with my anti-range (I thought it could help out by distributing damage better among my champs). It seems that my problems come from the fact that I just can't quite afford paying extra to get anti-range when my champions don't have it already. Also, Bloodthirsty Blade isn't always a good idea. I actually switched back to Punishing Aura on my Basilisk Templar, despite saying I'd be using Crushing Charge. I'll always love that ability, but Punishing Aura is just so good on Templar that I feel it in my bones when it's gone . On another note, my sub-70 nora champions aren't cutting it. Well, Sprite is great and Nectar Fairy has been useful (but mostly for the heal, I haven't used Stun much with it). But Garu Shaman and Mountain Garu especially might need to be replaced. I thought the shaman would be a nice healer with added usefulness from Solidify and would help the Draksar Berserker by virtue of being a Garu, but he's too slow. Granted, I can't say for certain because I haven't fully leveled them yet. The more I play though, the more I think I need Epochal Sage. Divine Favor doesn't require me to catch up to my units, which is great because I really tend to have my units somewhat apart, rather than clumped up. Haste is nice too. Another option would be Spirit Singer (whose Resurrect synergizes with the Short-Lived champs) because it comes with Cleansing Aura. I frequently feel that it would be nice to have more cleanse aside from Purge (which /partially/ solves the lack of Prestige too). Nectar Fairy could stand to be replaced too, either by a Bowmage (if my average nora can take the hit; I didn't do this from the start precisely because of that concern) or something else. I didn't expect Time Slip to work so nicely as an on-demand Stun spell, so I might be able to give up one Stun unit. I've been drooling over Rage of the Circle for a looong time now, and as it turns out he might be an option to consider: nice non-phys damage, a relocation ability and a sort-of-anti-range ability; almost perfect. I'm also considering Serpentor Ardent, for the Defiant+ Life Siphon. Hard to get, but not impossible and I'm talking mostly theoretically still. I have also been considering Guardian of the Circle. TL;DR: I need more beater, less fragile stuff, more anti-range (included in the champions or extremely cheap). Extra cleanse or shatter would be nice too, but I will likely not have the space. Advice needed!
tortun battle mystics are cheap as hell and are impervious to range, oakthumpers can become beastly tanks and they have shroud, wilderkin dancers are also cheap and they have evasive 3. For sturdiness, you can run garu den mothers, that are very efficient and will boost reinforcement greatly.
I never gave much attention to Bowmage's CA: Slam. not like a big loss, but it reminds me once again that I need to revisite upgrades...
New version: http://poxbase.com/#!/deck/cogcwvc8...4cdmc1jcoQs84s1as73s7us4Ks6gs5jr2or3nr2qe22e8 I added Garu Den Mother for sturdiness, for boosting the "Garu-ness" of the deck (mostly Draksar Berserker's Reinforcement) and for the Pounce on her Cub. Also, switched back to Bookburner over Conclave Warden and added Epochal Sage and Rage of the Circle. Oh, and Catharsis Bloom. I haven't actually made these changes in game yet, because while I can get both Epochal Sage and Rage, I'd rather be more sure before making effort to acquire them. I consider the slot Catharsis occupies as a 'free' slot, in the sense that even though Catharsis is good, I feel like I can take it out and try various stuff. The Runes I've also been considering for the slot are Burning Oak Seed and Combined Effort (and a few other, but less likely). If I switch it out for a Ghost Stalker and replace Mountain Garu with Perfected Runner, I can actually implement that DB module GabrielQ had mentioned (EDIT: ugh, I just realized I already have a lot of creatures, so that wouldn't work this way). Another possibility is Wild Elf for Detection and Punish, strenghtening the Punishing Aura/Punish aspect. In any case, Mountain Garu is currently 'on probation'. I would really appreciate it if anyone could look over this version and tell me if I'm missing anything or whether the BG is particularly weak in some area.
A new concept for you, leaving aside the punishing aura module and focusing more on stealth warcry ganks, using as element of control pin down/carnivorous vines + pacify http://poxbase.com/#!/deck/CwvCi2CwxcpBCf=cpfcpUCaKc8XCi4Cdms6wS7s1as4KS6gs5jr2or3nr2Yr3Q
this is what I came up with for your stun/punish: you kinda have to have 2 Baslsk Templars/Angel of War...why go for the theme if you only have 1 Baslsk Templar.... http://poxbase.com/#!/deck/CkKC89CogCoxCwvcpZChGcpVCpUcuvs2bs6Os7us6gsHr2or3nr2Yr2qe1Ve2we8e29 Petrifying Gaze via Templar/Dunes Manticore... Pin Down on Melee champs... Distract via Ospryan/Shimmering... Punishing Aura via Angel of War/Bas Templar... Bowmage CA: Stun and Imbue Stun... Oaken Mace for surprise Stun... Angel of Restoration for Healing/Entangling Attack together with Vines people just can't reach to you except for Pounce/Tele or whatever, but that's what Distract is for. Dusk Druid for shadowspawn while also offering Detection (that's why for Detection units I recommend having both Ospryan n Dusk as a 1x of depending on the situation) This is what I think KF/SL should be, although I only know 1-3 ppl who plays this kinda BG: Skywing Beacon + Reinforcement/Initiative (Blockade kills the deck...lucky due to Owlraider's nerf) http://poxbase.com/#!/deck/cphCwvCWc63cf4CpfCpUcjFcjnc8XCi4coQs84s1asYS1Hs6gr2or3nr2Yr2qe22e4e29 Its a bit hard to play AGAINST this BG if your using a slower deck, all the initiatives are just so annoying, by the time I have my champs contesting their font, they'd be sending everyone in with 7AP... same goes if I try to defend. He'll just send in a tough cookie before I can deploy a lot of stuff to one round him, and after that a river of champions just rushed my font with Initiatives/Reinforcements. What I find effective to use against these BGs are terrain alteration with big AoE (Cast: Hungry Mire), Mudsling, Ball n Chain, Stall, or just let him go in and one-round him using a cheap combo. If the first one falls, the others will soon follow. This BG's Cheese: Ressurect + Forbidden Fruit + Unstoppable champs (Kodiak) Forbidden Fruit + Initiative champs (to go up to an opponent, Perfc Runner) + Invigorate (Broodqueen) Commander: Ranger + Skywing Patrol + Perfected Runner Skywing Patrol (Drop Beacon) + Initiative champs (PerfRunner, Ranger Elite, Drak Berserker, Dugon) Wizard of the Ways can relocate your shadowspawned Catharsis Bloom to confuse opponent (Propagate self: people will assume its located 4 spaces away, but you've relocated your real Catharsis Bloom somewhere else). He can also relocate Hive which is crucial against lotsa Perseverance champs. But the real cheese is relocating Artillery Marker/Skywing Beacon, which is ghey. He also helps trigger Skywing Patrol's Relic Guardian bonus. 1) On Taint: Dugon's Vigilance triggers off Draksars Den Mother's Protective triggers off Draksars 2) btw, the calculation for Perf Runner: Perfected Runner (66 nora), giving Nora Globe (10 Nora) + Short-Lived (10 Nora), Soulsift (13 Nora)... so if you deploy him thru Beacon to come up to an enemy, and cast Resurrect on him, and put a Forbidden Fruit on him (assuming you'll get the Nora Globe after he died), you get 23 Nora back. So you're paying for 43 Nora Perfected Runner, and add Forbidden Fruit +45 Nora = 88 Nora for an Initiative Deathstroke kinda champ. This 88 Nora should be further discounted by assuming you will get opponent's Nora Globe. But then again, you'll have to have an Invig option nearby to Invig him after he's quipped with ForbFruit. 3) btw Cleansing Eme vs Purge, not sure, but I like Cleansing Eme way better. Purge is more expensive, does not contest a font, and only cleanses once, very redundant against debuffs such as Serkan/Heretic/whatever else that may be. 4) Quicken vs Quickening I'm not sure why, but I like Quicken only in specific BGs, but for this one, it plays similar to SL's powerturns and since I haven't tried playing this BG myself (I played AGAINST something like this), he uses Quicken and its a bit redundant in its cost. I'd rather have him save up 25 more nora and decimate my whole BG.
That is an awesome BG. It's close enough to what I like that I wanna try it. But it's not THE BG, so I'll playtest with replacements for Fae Oracle and Ranger Elite because to get all 3 I'd have to grind some more and also give up some high value cards that I like...though replacing them with cheaper stuff is going to be somewhat difficult. I could see Rascal Fairy taking Ranger Elite's place. EDIT: Spirit Singer sounds like a potential replacement for 1 Fae Oracle. I still give up Anthomancy unfortunately, but I get Resurrect and Cleansing Aura. Though Resurrect may be redundant with Transmission Relay. The reason I say this is not THE BG is just that it's a bit too full of wizards and stealth which overall give it an 'indirect' kind of feel, if I can put it that way. Though I could potentially give up a few of the Pacify champions for a couple more brutes, it looks like there are a lot of them anyways. As for RedScarlet's suggestions, that first deck looks seriously costly, both in terms of acquiring all the Runes and Nora-wise. The second BG is cool, but it's something else, not what I'm trying to do. It seems that this KF/SL kind of split is comfortable enough for me to play around with it for a while, so I might get to test something like that. Both of you have been offering suggestions and I really appreciate that and I have been integrating bits of them into my thought processes. But I feel like I should clarify a couple of things: First, the Punishing Aura/Punish module was not a 'main thing' that I initially built my BG around. It just so happened that it was there and it was extra nice. Adding more of it is cool and all, but that doesn't mean I feel the need to overfocus on it or that again, it was ever a main thing. I get that you're attempting to increase synergy to make the BG stronger. Second, suggested new BGs are useful, but not AS useful to me as simply someone looking over the BG I post and telling me what its problems are. The thing I want you to understand is that I'm not building this for any fancy purposes, the way many splits are built. I'm treating this as a personal quest of sorts. Trying to find that one BG that will fit me like a glove. This may sound silly to you, but I have to insist in my request that you'd rather look over my latest version and give me some advice on it. Again, I appreciate all sugestions in any form, but I'd especially appreciate this. None of the things I do with the BG are "random", they all have this purpose of getting it to fit me perfectly.
