Minotaur Sentry/Dimension Door

it was just -5 nora, no +5hp (from 78 to 73). I used him, Aspect of Oblivion, Bok Raider and Magma Elemental as comparisions, when Unhinged Bok was buffed (and nerfed) and I tried to somehow justified her.

I think we all can agree about drawbacks of Minotaurs and stuff. we could also agree that relic for 1 AP might be too good.

increasing nora cost of abilities doesn't require additional coding. making this ability to cost 3 AP shouldn't break the champion, but it might feel more fair.

 

Why do we care if other things may be even more efficient? This gets brought up all the time.

If something is over the line it's over the line. Nerf it, then if there are other things that are over the line, well go right on ahead and nerf them too.

 

The comment above from BigChief is spot on. I see a couple of related issues:

1) Regarding Ranged Damage and AOE (cones, bombs and etc) damage - too much, too fast, too easy, too cheap!
2) Regarding speed (not just the stat, but the ability of a champ to GET places) - teleport, fly, leap, tunnel, bloodseek, phantomdash - all basically undercost for what they bring to the table.
3) Regarding Map Size: Most are far too small, reward splashing mobility enhancements (see above), and make it impossible to play any kind of "long game" (unless it's some form of lame ass "turtling standoff to prepare for powerturn wtfbbq I win lol gg kthxbai)

In short: the balance between map size, champ movement capabilities, and damage output potential makes the maximin requirements for melee champs insane (in order to maximize minimum gain for running, deploying, and using any melee champ, that champ has to be super-powered and super-cheap). The minimax requirements for running a flying/leaping/teleporting ranged champ are equally insane (minimizing the maximum loss when choosing to run, deploy, use such a champ leads to it being "worth it" to run a relatively expensive champ).

Two champs with: 7 spd, 12 dam, and 45 HP. One has flying and range 2-5, the other has block, dodge, and range 1. Which do you take given both cost 80 nora. What would the right price point be to get you to run the melee champ? Would it be the addition of 3 more abilities at the same cost? What would be the price point where you would NOT run the flying champ?

Make the maps bigger. Put the fonts further from the shrines, and balance player 2's distance. NO font should ever be within 9 spaces of a shrine, unless BOTH are within 6 spaces of a shrine.

Drop damage output across the board, full stop, end of story... NERF DAMAGE!!!

Increase the cost of champs with amazing movement capabilities OR recode impassable/chasm terrain (make them more like mud/water/tar/lava, only more damaging and/or more impeding).

Limit the number of abilities on champs, and make rarity correlate to "flexibility" - commons should be your beaters. Not less powerful, just less adaptable. Exos should be your "synergizers" (not as directly powerful, but they can do more interesting stuff).

 

Again what is the point of even making these threads when the devs have stated numerous times that they are basically removing 8/10 of the abilities off of every single champ in the game.

From orbit.

 

Because they help us think through, hash out, and gnaw upon conceptualizations of the game... writing a post helps me visualize a strategy, whether it's primary an attacking or primarily a countering strategy...

 

I know right? Why do we even have forums when discussion won't even matter. Jeez guys, give him a medal.

Not really

 

Fair enough. I mean there are so many offenders, I think a simpler more straight forward pox will end up being a lot more enjoyable.

Things really got out of hand at the end of the soe era.

 

Excavator's Mine's use is not restricted to a race. Nor is that race an almost entirely all melee race in a range dominated game.

 

I disagree with this quite strenuously. Minotaurs w/o dimension door are still very powerful. Dimension door adds an element of rapid movement that makes their strengths (survivability, toughness, damage dealing, debuffing) almost insurmountable in many, many situations.

That said, the flavor that the doors bring is really cool.

So: tone down the toughness/survivability of Minos as a whole, or tone down the damage output in general, and/or tweak the doors a bit to either a) make them easier to kill, b) make them harder to deploy, or c) make them harder to use as effectively (reduce their range, give the ability a CD that's on the door, not on the champ, or something).

 

i think axe is right in saying these guys have plenty enough RANGE compensation without teleporting all over the place.......as he pointed out many of these guys have an alternate range attack really and truely this is just as strange as range since its more versatile.......what is the best champ to deploy to a solo font? one with both a melee and a range attack......that way he can cover the situation no matter what.....minotuars have that......they dont need to teleport 6 spaces for 2 ap.......this should cost at least 3 ap and have a higher cooldown since every minotaur can do it.....also yea i agree.....flamecrusher is not being cast in every UD bg cause it sucks......it obviously needs to be nerfed a lil.....i think its mainly the shrinking attack thats so ridiculous.

 

About the Sentry. Perhaps have his Door be a Summon (cant contest) and/or be a one use only?

 

lets compare to:

Draksar Gunner
Draksar Doomslayer
Draksar Knight

all comes at 60~~ nora.

and non of em is as effective as this minotaur is.

 

let's not compare late game champs to early game ones.

 

Add an SL rune in there otherwise people might call you out on hidden zealotry for the Lands

 

Emmmm, I wish I knew what to nerf from SL.

 

Skywings probably

 

Vex

 

Well skillwingz have been borken for such a long time, should've been nerfed ages ago, and vex just had a terrible design.

 

Right now I am playing : IS meta, Constructs, Leoss, Kanen, FS, SP, FW and Minotaurs on a daily basis. Saying that someone can't make a nerf thread about an Overpowered rune because they are using Overpowered runes is silly. You just stated for example Flamecrusher needs a tap then went on to say nerf about 15 different thinks, bit counterintuitive to you're earlier statement directed at me.

Trying to drag attention away from the overpowered runes within the faction you play using simply 'other factions runes are even more Op get them first !!' instead of making reasoned suggestions as to how your own OP runes could be fixed, just makes you look like a zealot, you are better than that my friend.

I agree with you that perhaps minotaurs are not the Number 1 priority right now, but Sentry is well up there in terms of the greatest offenders and prime example of SoE's powercreep cost efficiency that needs to be changed.

 

I like this thread!!