i dont push people down rabbit holes, you should choose that or not. im not even here to inform you, you can inform yourself, if that's what you choose. how else... people learn / believe more when they do their own research. i posted because i get fed up of seeing people without a clue debate on things obvious to me. my links (not all) may be dubious to you lefties especially with the big push to ban alt media. i go wherever the truth is i don't care where i tread but as geressen said some of these sites and info has been labelled as bad, there are even mainstream news that should make you think differently when you know more. i have visited alt media and conspiracy sites for a long time. its getting the way of becoming an enemy of the state for reading and believing the things i do. half of it could get me locked up in a psych ward. i don't really want to get anyone in trouble, or even set them on such a path let alone push them. an hour trawling for links for you would not do this justice and apologies for confusing or offending you burn since you have always been ok with me but liberals usually do not want to see the info anyway let alone believe it, usually their mind was made up long ago. re-read meatman's post. it goes beyond political correctness. there are some of my views i do not talk about nor would you understand unless you have seen all i have.
I mean, dunno. I can only expect the worst if you don't give me anything. Like, I live in Europe (Belgium/Netherlands) and I have yet to see my govt crumble under Sharia Law, let alone see Muslim violence. There's been some in Germany, but Merkel was ******** about it so there's that. There's this organisation called "Sharia for X" (X being the country they're in, there's a sharia for Belgium, Sharia for Britain etc). They tried to get Sharia Law implemented and recruit for ISIS etc. We rounded them fools up and sentenced them in a court of law. They did not have a good time. The impact of the immigration crisis is that, an immigration crisis, it's not a muslim crisis. This is such a broad generalization though. There's already a massive filtration in place to get into the US, you have one of the most rigorous vetting systems in the world. Also, it's weird to me after his first sentence, because his second sentence expresses a sentiment that is countered by the first. --- To me, you can't say "we should ban all muslims until we get proper vetting" for 3 reasons in this case You already have proper vetting You didn't actually ban all muslims (which is an already bad idea) You left out all the countries that are actually responsible for getting terrorists into the US (even though mentioned, lets state it again) The whole "attack on US soil by muslims is imminent" is so overblown. There were how many deaths of muslim terrorists in the US last year? How many from white right wing christians? Heck, i'ts but a fraction of deaths each year due to gun death violence. I don't understand why you'd go through such drastic measures, screw over so many people, people with families/lives/dreams build up in the US, on the off chance that you block someone out who intends to attack the US. I could understand if the chances were REALLY HIGH and it was a matter of "alright if we don't do this we're super ****ed so we just gotta do it now", but it's not. It's really not. It's so much fear and propaganda turning you all to a frenzy. I have never heard Trump say once "lets ban all guns because sometimes shootings happen, so we just gotta ban all of them until we figure out a better vetting system". Over 10 000 people are killed each year in the US by firearms. But you accept that. That's a "price you pay for freedom" or however you justify it. But the irrational fear that ISIS is gonna invade North Carolina next week is somehow a justification for ruining thousands, if not millions of lives. People who are visiting family, now to return to the US where they have been forever/done. People who left for work and returned/done. People who's dog is waiting for them in their appartment/no warning,done. People who helped betray their people, who have spied and helped the US in their own countries, sold everything and left for the US /done, sorry mate, cheers for sacrificing your life for us though. To me, Trump just felt like pandering to an extremely afraid right wing base, and implemented a monstrosity of policy that does not belong in the 21st century. Before you say Obama banned Iraq's citizens, yeah, there was also a war going on there. You're not at war with all those countries. You're at war with a miniscule part of a religion, but you have successfully demonized the whole religion based on fear and lies. Let me ask you, how did ISIS rise again? Was it... instability, fear and anger from the locals when the US invaded their countries and things they shouldn't be doing? Uhuh. Now ask yourself how many of these people he banned are going to be upset, desperate, with no way to turn. I can't possibly see how ISIS loses in this situation.
The difference, BP, and I am not saying I agree with this reasoning, is that gun violence is acceptable because it preserves American's freedom. Immigration doesn't impede on any rights they care about because they are not Americans, and therefore they do not deserve what America offers.
It is not a ban on muslim countries. It is a ban on countries that have the highest populations of refugees, mercenaries, and have the highest terror alert. Iran should not be on that list. Saudi Arabia should be on that list. I suggest you get your news from some other source than places like daily show, cnn, msnbc. Bunch of main stream cuck shows. IT IS NOT A BAN ON MUSLIMS!!!! US is about to make moves in Syria they don't want to worry about a bunch of wahabi idiots pulling some terrorist crap in USA. Holy crap stop saying it is a ban on Muslims LOL. The six most populous muslim nations Indonesia, India, Pakistan, Nigeria, and Egypt are not banned. Jordan is not banned. ........................ Stop with main stream media narrative of Ban on Muslims. It is not true. Besides the Obama administration banned these same countries in 2011 and you didn't see the media pulling this crap on Obama. You have to understand this is an attack on Trump. It is a pile of horse crap. Comon bro you are smarter than american media.
Well, sure, it's not TECHNICALLY a ban on Muslims, but who are we kidding? It's clear that it is the MUSLIM population within those countries it is targeted at. Glad we agree Saudi Arabia not being on the list is bloody weird though. I mean, Trump himself, during his campaign, repeatedly talked about banning Muslims from entering the country. Now suddenly: "it's not about religion." Give me a Firking break. Yes, I understand and get that the underlying idea is terrorists - but let's not pretend that it's specifically MUSLIM terrorists this is concerned about. In other words, it CAN BE BOTH Muslim AND Terrorists they are targeting. Imagine that. AND instead of OR. Note, however, that due to the specific nature of this EO, they are ALSO affecting non-Terrorists Muslims (though some people don't believe they exist) AND non-Terrorists non-Muslims, while at the same time, not actually targeting all the places it seems like they should be targeting. Don't get me wrong, I am not going to go around saying it's not constitutional or whatever. America can decide who/how/when people get in, that's fine. I just think this is an ineffective solution to an overblown problem largely done for political points. ~ And Obama banning those same countries is actually not factual, it was actually ONE COUNTRY, and was based on ACTUAL EVIDENCE that improper screening had happened: http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/al-qa...terrorists-country-refugees/story?id=20931131 Unlike Trump's immigration ban, which is extremely broad, not based on actual credible evidence, initially affected green card holders, and has no real actionable items, the Obama ban was specific to the problem area, based on an actual, documented problem, and had a plan to address that specific issue. It's pretty different than this EO in almost EVERY RESPECT. The countries banned ARE, however, on a list of countries Obama adminstration named as sources of terror. I suggest you get your news from some other source than right-wing propaganda machines.
http://www.businessinsider.com/big-...ation-ban-obamas-2011-policy-2017-2/#intent-2 http://foreignpolicy.com/2017/01/30...-did-nothing-similar-to-your-immigration-ban/ http://www.snopes.com/president-obama-ban-muslims-2011/ the top 3 things that pop up when i google "obama ban 2011". the next thing is directly contradictory to not only the first few, but also pretty much the rest of the first page. if you're suggesting that i go past google's first page, then i'm going to have to assume you're a 'borg
I love the part about how the State Department had no clue what was going to be in this thing. It's no wonder the whole thing was such a mess, the Trump administration seemed to have just sprung this on people without consulting the relevant parties.
uh no. No it's not targeting muslims. That narrative is pushed by the idiotic MSM. It definitely targeting extremists and mercenaries who want payback for drone bombing their countries. Let's face it Obama was a 3rd and 4th term of Bush. On his 3rd day in office he was bombing Pakistan. I feel for these people who were robbed of their homes. I would want payback too if some idiot was supporting Israel's imperialist agenda and using the CIA to financially back nutbag wahabis and salafists destabilized my country. Stop these problems at the source. Stop all aid to Israel. USA needs to stop fighting their wars. We need to put a leash on the military industrial complex and lockheed and martin, and boeing. De regulate alot of restrictive failed polices and let the free market run.
Please read and stop posting links ABC 123 Firking bullshit news networks that grab ankle for zionists and hysterical progressives who do not live in reality. Actual link to the travel ban bill created by the obama administration. CREATED BEFORE TRUMP DID HIS TRAVEL BAN. H.R. 158 https://www.congress.gov/114/bills/hr158/BILLS-114hr158rds.pdf
That really doesen't prove anything except some biast blogger/reporter is good at pushing his own bullsht agenda.
No sok, you don't understand. Trump has called for a muslim ban, only banned muslim countries, no distinction whatsoever between people who have a residence in the US or not, no distinction between people who sacrificed everything to help the US in Iraq and randomers, no no it's an extrimist ban, not muslim it just happens to be the case that every person from that country, even when living before in America is a threat, Firk their life, what's it to us?
You guys are hilarious. Going down the rabbit hole with all the other hysterical leftist nutters who listen to the same bunch of main stream media idiots who publish anything lies or truth as long as it forwards their agenda to demonize Trump.
It's always hilarious to me how the most insane conspiracy theorist nutjobs accuse others of being crazy. Yeah, Trump is not ruining the lives of thousands, if not millions with collateral damage. Again, where are all those terrorist attacks by muslims in the US the past decade? How many deaths? Firk all kid, that's how many.
Dude this is not some pissing contest to prove my daddy is better than yours. Read H.R. 158 bill. Trump is banning these countries based on the high level of terrorist activity, mercenaries and refugees that exist there. Seriously this whole progressive movement kills all the credibility democrats ever had and makes these SJW journalists look like a bunch of dishonest 5 yr olds.
I mean, are we pretending Trump didn't say he was gonna ban 1,6 billion muslims all campaign long, like do we actually need to still prove this again?
You realize you linked a CONGRESSIONAL BILL introduced by a Republican Congressman and not an Obama executive order, correct? https://www.congress.gov/bill/114th-congress/house-bill/158 You also realize this was in 2015, not 2011 as the action you claimed? Lastly, this bill doesn't ban anything... rather, it outlines the procedures by which the DHS is to evaluate countries to determine if it should be banned (note that it doesn't say the PRESIDENT has to abide by these rules). Making this statement: Factually false. Obama did NOT ban these same countries in 2011. You can't "spin" your way out of this lie.
Listen here moron do you think it justifiable to ban millions of people from entering your country, even if they were on holiday/work while they had lived in the US with student or work visas, just because he's banning countries with "high level of terrorist activity, mercenaries and refugees" that exist there? Where is the evidence? Where is even the slightest indication that this is a problem requiring such drastic collateral damage measures? Where are all these terrorist attacks in the past years? Have they all been waiting to hit trump on day 14, so he had to ban them before that?
