The FS discussion - My thoughts and why there is an underlying problem.

Yea I agree it was pretty well written.


Viva La Revolution

 

Thanks

 

Burn just graduated 3rd ban and wanted to show us his pro prose skillz.

 

In my defense, I woke up and wrote this wall of text. I've found a lot of errors looking over it again, but I can't be bothered editing everything.

 

It's good stuff bropryo.

 

FS is so good the mirror is 6/4.


But seriously, goodstuff's versatility has always been its selling point. Playing power-whack-a-mole gets a bad rap, but tapping on the few standouts that let FS play at these extreme times would do work. I've had less experience and time going over Drown or Mushroom, so I'll talk specifically about Hippos. Their power is not just in relation to other spells, but in relation to the expected stats of champions. ~30 damage off of shrine + 1 font passes over a balancing point. That this is flat damage is especially important: it can be used as a cleanup tool from 60% life. In my more brief experience with FS, the strength of rushes fell most heavily on Hippos, and their enabling of swift and brutal swings in board presence.

 

Mushroom is so insane that it would still be strong with 10 less hp and no vuln poison.

 

Mushroom 15hp
Drown 85 Nora
Hippos 7 dam
Toad loses lethargic

 

With those changes it wouldn't b worth running in any way at all.

Not sure what the whole issue with the mushroom actually is. is it the damage it deals on deploy from the 6 damage cloud? is it the vuln it grants? the hp?

 

all 3... The hp makes it good for contesting with its cost if it comes down to it. The damage on deploy is pretty significant and the amp + vuln is good.

 

Find me another relic that does as much as this one in a contesting scenario.

 

you see, this is my issue. it doesn't really do anything. you need other units in conjunction with this one to really get any affect other than 6 damage on its deploy which then raises the issue of what you invest and what you receive and since you require a poison unit specifically in lots of scenarios the mushroom isn't viable. the actual issue isn't really the mushroom its what deploys it. From what im reading the issue really seems to be the toad and the mushroom seems to be riding the nerf train because of it and the idea of it doing a lot is that it does 6 damage? c thunderhead totem and a plethora of other relics.

 

Nicely done Burny de Pyro. I enjoyed reading it in its entirety.

Absolutely loved that you touched on consistency! Few people appreciate this aspect.

 

A little over a week ago he also came to the FS forums for extra insight. #Dedication #Respect

 

nah, first thunderhead totem is 15 nora of abilities and 15 hp for a total of 45 nora(it also has a drawback in instability but no listed nora price so you can ignore it). The foulest mushroom is 19 nora of abilities and 25 hp for 30 nora. it has almost a 1:1 hp to nora ratio which is frowned upon when champs or relics have this (see Sacred Temple).

 

Its frowned up when champs have this to be more accurate. for example ive made a new relic for the game. its called the relic that does nothing. it has 30 hp. and costs 25 nora. no abilities. no basic attack. no means of movement.nothing. its just 30 hp. is it worth its cost?

 

This is kind of FS' motto, really.


Anyway, the main weaknesses of FS have generally been two things:

1. Little DEF reduction. 2. No Spot Cleanse.

There are a couple of issues with this right out of the gate. Lack of Spot Cleanse only really matters for a few key effects or situations, and most of the particularly nasty debuff abilities have become very expensive nora-wise. The current meta emphasizes the use of efficient stat blocks, which may exacerbate this particular point. But it is worth noting that FW is generally considered a stronger matchup against FS, and not really because of Drown's restrictions (though that doesn't hurt).

With DEF penetration as mentioned there's still ways around that anyway. Cones, Assassinate for the Firk BG, using Pirahnids with high enough DMG that they don't particularly care, or DoT/Ping application, which can slowly cut through HP regardless of DEF.

 

No, because sacred temple exists.

If you made a relic that did nothing and had 30 hp for 10-15 nora, it would probably be used simply because of how strong that was.

Also, if you think that mushroom does nothing, there must be something wrong with you.

 

by its self the mushroom deals some damage. no poison units = no benefit. so the issue always comes back to what else is in play. not the relic.

also on my hypothetical situation, your making the assumption I deployed the relic in a font. what happens if I deploy the relic in the middle of the map where there is no font? how is it now strong? assumption again within the argument around the mushroom seems to be that the mushroom automatically deploys on a font. which it doesn't, the situation may demand its deploy away from a font which in turn diminishes its results after all as I already pointed out relics tend to not be able to move of their own accord.

 

Every faction has there good runes and combos. I think you can give a good player like Pyro a decent BG and he'll still win more games than a mediocre player like myself.

That being said, FS is the only faction i've played for years. Thanks to Pyro it's now the cool bandwagon faction for ego egocentric people who will play total cheese to win matches. I cant enjoy playing my faction and losing like I all ways do without people *****ing and crying about the op runes. Do you have any idea how infuriating it is to lose a match and have someone *****ing about your runes the entire time? In closing, I would like to ask Pyro to leave the swamp & take all the fair weather, band wagon FS players with him. Go pick another faction to exploit.

My qq is over, thank you & have a nice day.