Do you want to see the FW bonus changed?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by kalasle, Jul 28, 2015.

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Do you want to see the FW bonus changed?

  1. Yes

    30.8%
  2. No

    69.2%
  1. kalasle

    kalasle Forum Royalty

    Dark brought this up in another thread, so here's a straightforward poll. Do you want to see the FW bonus get changed to something else, besides just cooldown reduction? Feel free to supply more information in a post.
     
  2. BurnPyro

    BurnPyro Forum Royalty

    I support you.
     
  3. Lushiris

    Lushiris I need me some PIE!

    I'd like it to be something else, NOT cooldown reduction.
     
  4. IMAGIRL

    IMAGIRL Forum Royalty

    No. People may not like it, but the faction is attrition, and griefing. It need to stay that way.
     
    TheBulwark and Ifem21 like this.
  5. darklord48

    darklord48 Forum Royalty

    I voted no because I like the attrition aspect. If it were to be changed, the only change I would support would be to add extra rune reveals to allow BGs with less champs to be run, since the increased cooldown mitigates the chances of running out of champs.
     
  6. DrSteve

    DrSteve I need me some PIE!

    Yes. It's either incredibly useful (borderline broken) or utterly useless depending on your bg, and is almost entirely unnoticeable in splits. The entire faction is not attrition, and anyone who says that has not played the full spectrum of bgs that that faction has to offer. I'm thankful that chopping block attrition bgs are much more uncommon than they used to be, and that i haven't had to deal with a 3 xulos deploy game since i've been back.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2015
    Lushiris likes this.
  7. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    Perhaps we should mention what has been considered if the bonus was changed, and that it probably won't happen without also changing Boon.
    • Change Faction Bonus to ??? (Bonus Nora on globes?)
    • Removing Boon
    • Putting some aspects of Boon/Faction Bonus onto each of the sub-Undead races (for example, Spirits may get cooldown reduction, while Zombies get nora on globes)
    But this basically requires thinking about how each of the themes play, and giving them something that caters to their playstyle, while making the Bonus itself more generically useful.
     
  8. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    Do you feel Undead/Boon can be worked on without touching the Bonus?
     
  9. IMAGIRL

    IMAGIRL Forum Royalty

    I still say Undead should work like Dragonkin.
     
  10. Bonice90

    Bonice90 I need me some PIE!

    how about? everytime an unit from your faction recovers a nora globe the nearrest opposing champion loses x hp (half for splits)
     
  11. kalasle

    kalasle Forum Royalty

    Nora globes are a finicky, frustrating, terrible thing to have in any way associated with a faction bonus, for some of the same reasons Creepers don't function (as a theme) with just on-kill triggers. They're an astoundingly swingy and high-variance mechanic.
     
    SireofSuns, TheBulwark and mw24 like this.
  12. darklord48

    darklord48 Forum Royalty

    I do, starting with converting the undead race similar to Dragon-kin like @IMAGIRL said.
     
    themacca and IMAGIRL like this.
  13. Bellagion

    Bellagion I need me some PIE!

    A few random thoughts:

    • Wouldn't Bloodless on Skeletons remove like half of their synergies? Ie. Altar of Bones, Sacrificial Altar, Throw Bones, Bone Circle Archmage, Foul Rite
    • Isn't poison immunity across a theme making a previous mistake seeing that it just got removed from Boon?
    • I never did understand why Liches were considered a theme in themselves. It seems like they are the overlords over the less sentient undead so it would make sense if they had some use in the other themes' decks. Lich always seemed like more of a class to me than a race.
    • I agree with the Commander/Boost stuff but I question whether every race really needs a racial. It seems like something that has become standard but leads to sort of contrived themes.
    • Removing mandatory fearless/disease immunity is probably good at this point. They rarely help except in a few cases in which they hard counter a couple themes/runes (usually in mirrors).
     
    themacca likes this.
  14. Lushiris

    Lushiris I need me some PIE!

    Yetis cry everytime.
     
    IMAGIRL, Bellagion and PhdNiceGuy like this.
  15. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    Mostly because most FW players see Boon as their real faction bonus. That is not to say that the true one doesn't do work, but the value is more nebulous, and certainly doesn't benefit all BGs the way Boon's effect could.

    Yea, which is more or less in line with what I'd do, except I'd learn towards changing the Faction bonus at the same time to something more generic, and give the less generic stuff to the themes.
     
  16. kalasle

    kalasle Forum Royalty

    Just cause MW says it doesn't mean it's true. Boon is a piece of sandbag crap, only useful for the disease immunity; the faction bonus keeps FW functional.
     
    hfok, Ifem21, Netherzen and 2 others like this.
  17. yobanchi

    yobanchi I need me some PIE!

    From what I see the current FW bonus of cooldown would fit much better as a minute racial on a few champs or theme designed to make it work.

    For instance if spirits had Spirit Boon: this champion has %60 cooldown reduction and the theme is based on efficient recycling mechanics NOT just spamming low cost champs. Ties it easier to a theme instead of a blanket bonus resulting in only a few runes benefitting from it.
     
    mw24 and PhdNiceGuy like this.
  18. kalasle

    kalasle Forum Royalty

    What's the deal with Spirits getting this theoretical CDR racial? They seem like the absolute last Undead race that would make serious use of that.
     
    mw24 likes this.
  19. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    The way I see is currently is that if, for example, only did this:
    • Remove Nora on Globes from Boon, replacing with CDR
    • Remove CDR from Faction Bonus, replacing with Nora on Globes
    Functionally, nothing really changes (for anything with Boon).

    So then, however I divvy up Boon would be the part that impacts faction identity.
     
    yobanchi likes this.
  20. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    Fine, I'll give it to Witches!
     
    BurnPyro likes this.

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