That's exactly part of the problem tho. If you assume that the opponent has no way or will to play around it, then in the ideal scenario this thing could be ridiculously powerful without the AP sap. But that's not really the reality, yet the possibility has to be accounted for. That's the kind of stuff that is very hard to balance right. It's why things like Bursticade gets nerfed hard because even though it wasn't the most efficient thing in the world, every so often it wins a game all by itself.
barricade + the ST spell that gave all relics frost aura. cast barricade around someone, cast the st spell, do hella damages also created impeding snow around the relics iirc. made it rather obnoxious to clear the barricades, and very difficult in many situations to do so before the death of the champion(s) inside
champions with NKD2 (since 1 isn't that big of a problem to change to Dodge/Block if that's really the case?) Kas Apprentice Kas Guide Jakei Warfoot Jakei Shadowstriker Jakei Mindstriker Kento Kas Adherent Kas Apprentice could become a mirror version of Kas Master. Kas Master has anti-range through elusive, but has block+riposte. Apprentice could be Dodge+Arrowthrower + melee control through Snow Fall/Freezing Aura? Kas Guide is a support, but it does everything, like a baws. could easily lose this ability for design/balance purposes and get something different. Jakei Warfoot is shoeboxed so zero problems here how it will end up, might just be complete redesign. Shadowstriker already has a defensive mechanism through stealth, not much problems to change it. Jakei Mindstriker could be considered as Jakei Warfoot. basically, we have two champions. Kento and Adherent. Adherent is just a copycat champion. rework it and call it day. all this hassle is virtually about Kento. find a solution other than inventing new ability. basically, all tracks lead to NKD becoming slightly different version than Oblivion Shield. perhaps Kento could use some exception or just rework it at all. going case by case, I don't see that much of need to invent new ability for NKD. it's not an ability to begin with. it's just a bundle. too much hassle for it. revamp is a much bigger picture than it.
Oh, just remembered Veiled Flight grants Flying. It's just hard to recall since only one unit has ever had it Precedent! ^^ Maybe Running Start should grant flying too, rather than flight. Maybe regular Flight should grant Sentry rather than flying itself. Just so not all types of flying give it
My only concern about NKD is this: do we really need yet another ability that punishes players who run melee champions?
I think the very specific details are still up in the air, which is why I focused on discussing the underlying mechanics. Though you do make a good point and I think it's relevant that you brought it up.
Sokolov, what do you think about reusing the code from granite bracers? Just making the first attack miss would be kind of an alternative form of oblivion shield. Is there a chance to code a local counterattack that wouldn't trigger on, say, blizzard cloak misses?
I think I'd like Nokan Do as something simpler to do with "dodging" maybe: "The first close-combat attack against this unit each turn has it's damage reduced by this unit's current AP and the opposing champion loses all remaining AP." Basically means the more "ready" the unit is, the less damage he'll take. It also means that one melee combatant will be pretty stuffed losing all his AP each turn. Tbh what I dislike atm is the definition of "melee". Mostly due to the number of range 1-2 champions. I think, if the unit has a range of 1 as a minimum, then 2 should also class as being melee. a range of 1-2 is basically a long reaching melee weapon.
Look, I understand that we try and make things more realistic with these sorts of 'selective immunities' due to factions and races and such, but I find it to be more of a hamstring than a boon. Having creatures with immunities, resistances, or vulnerabilities across that board is a negative aspect. It limits the viability of themes as we've seen with poison and disease. I know it's painful to imagine a golem getting sick, but justify it through some sort of "supernatural ultraplague" (think Nurgle from Warhammer) so we don't have themes with blanket immunities "just because it's more 'realistic'". What's worse is that we're cherry picking resistances too, why can get constructs get charmed or feared? Aren't they autonomous? Why can skeletons get bloodied? It's just better for the game if we remove these sorts of global resistances in favor of increasing the viability of different themes.
I absolutely agree. When logic and balance get in each others way: screw logic. Just discard it. It doesn't matter a bit in comparison.
Nevar! Also, I would like to formally start a petition to prevent the wandering zombie being affected by decapitate after gaining headless. (I actually agree ofc ^^)
This is very important and I completely agree. The flavor immunities are arbitrary and negatively impact the game.
Agreeing here. The problem with boon is that it's just power without gameplay. Sprinkling resistances, immunities, and vulnerabilities here and there creates gameplay. how you play your fire vulnerable or fire resistant champs changes when you are playing against an enemy with a fire attack. That's cool and good. But boon doesn't do that. If you are playing against a poison bg you don't have to search for your poison immune champ, you just deploy whatever and you are already ahead of your opponent. The same is true for construct immunities which should also go. Likewise, if you have one champ with dead eater, you maneuver it so that it can pick up a globe. However, with boon you don't care and any of your champs get a bonus for doing what you normally do. With boon you don't have to work for fearless or make sure your fearless champs are fighting who they need to be or try to cleanse your units, you just completely annihilate any decision making with regards to fear by virtue of playing undead. The worst part about boon is that it warps what it is immune to. Either poison, fear, disease needs to be stronger (and therefore op against everything else) to deal with the fact that it will get randomly hard countered, or it will be as strong as other themes and mechanics and just instalose to boon. So everything except undead are punished because of boon's existence If a champ needs disease immunity because it's gonna be up close fighting with your disease aura champs, then yes it should have disease immunity so that you aren't punished for doing what you want to do with zombies. But boon as a whole (and construct immunity) needs to go. Having individual runes that hardcounter other individual runes is good, that is why you have 30 in a bg. Having one faction invalidate whole mechanics is not cool. Flavor is awesome; just not when it trumps gameplay. (Also I could totally make the case that undead should, if anything, have a vulnerability to disease) (Also Also, why not turn sonar into a weaker psychic ping that, say, prevents attacks against the damaged champ from missing, and then place it on fewer champs. That could be flavorful and cool.)
the problem with boon is that its so pervasive. and its pervasive because of race: undead (and analgous arguments apply to race: demon and others). imo 'undead' should be an 'archetype'. race would be a category subordinate to the archetype. now that you have created a new category (archetype or whatever you want to call it), you can code things to key off of archetype or race. You may like the idea of all undead being immune to fear, then that is an ability conferred by the undead archetype. but resistant to poison might make more sense on skeltons than it does on zombies, liches, or vampires. So now that you have some hierarchy to the race (and class) tags, you can distribute bonuses and penalties with more control. I still like the idea of racial specific benefits, they are very flavorful and make factions/themes feel more unique and not the same old runes with a different paint job. In fact, I'd like to see a lot more race (and class) specific abilities (penalties).
I agree with boon being a problem but seriously people... if you change boon you have to change the faction bonus for FW most games are decided before it is ever used (unless ofcourse dmg in general is reduced and less onerounding going on ... which it doesnt look like till now). Preferably change it to something useful for my witches.
Whats the average damage of champions with NKD vs the average defense in the game? Not counting tough or other damage reduction abilities it would seem that you would still be effective vs most champions out there unless they only have like 10 damage. edit: Also with the whole refocusing of what a theme is can we expand past damage type = theme mindsets. There is literally way way more to a theme then everyone having the same ability or damage type and I for one am extremely happy to see DOG going down that type of road with themes.
Perhaps what might help the devs in that vein would be for players to start listing out the themes they feel have a fleshed out and coherent identity beyond a racial, so they can see what players like currently.
