Pro-life Texas lawmaker introduces bill imposing death penalty for abortion

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by JazzMan1221, Mar 14, 2021.

  1. JazzMan1221

    JazzMan1221 Better-Known Member

    https://truthout.org/articles/pro-l...ces-bill-imposing-death-penalty-for-abortion/

    '“It’s time Republicans make it clear that we actually think Abortion is murder,” Slaton’s statement said. In a tweet about the proposal, Slaton also claimed the bill would “guarantee the equal protection of the laws to all Texans, no matter how small.” The bill would ban all abortions from the point of fertilization, and would not make any exceptions for **** or incest.'

    [​IMG]

    This reeks of as much stupidity as the old laws punishing attempted suicide with the death penalty. I'm surprised this isn't a Florida man story tbh. "Pro-life" indeed lol.
     
  2. chickenpox2

    chickenpox2 I need me some PIE!

    I mean seriously not even **** victims that harsh

    Watch suicide rate increase 1000 fold after this law gets passed
     
  3. Geressen

    Geressen Forum Royalty

    '“It’s time Republicans make it clear what we actually think "

    fixed it
     
  4. IMAGIRL

    IMAGIRL Forum Royalty

    r/nottheonion

    I watched a mini-documentary on the pro-life/choice thing a long while back an it was the interview with a nun that stuck with me. (It was a long time ago so this is not verbatim) She states that she is both pro choice and pro life an in an ideal world there would be no discussion on the subject and that everyone would be pro-life. She goes on to state however that his is not an ideal world an as such she leans to pro-choice. She states that most do not recognize what pro life means, and that pro life isn't just 'pro birth' it is 'pro life' meaning that you are 'pro birth, pro baby gets adequate amounts of love and care, pro education for said child, pro my child will grow up in an environment that will give it opportunities and choices for careers etc... and that any mother who cannot reasonably guarantee these options or others for their child should be within their right to not subject their child to such misfortune. I don't recall the nun ever broaching the topic of the mothers body, but she did really drive home the point that the arguments of pro life/choice isn't about whether the child lives or dies, but by how well it could live and any institution that cannot guarantee a good life has no place dictating this incredibly hard and controversial choice for the mother. She then alluded to the fact that if such a thing was not the case then her job might very well exist in a different capacity; seemingly implying that she was running a church organized orphanage/group home.

    I think it was a post WWII interview and I've tried to find the video for a long time now, but have never been able to find it. I reference her speech anytime the subject of Life/Choice comes up and it doesn't come often so I'm sure I've romanticized her speech, but I think the overall tone and speech is intact for the most part.
     
  5. darklord48

    darklord48 Forum Royalty

    I think Carlin sums up Pro-Life the best. Language warning for those who care about that kind of thing.
     
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  6. chickenpox2

    chickenpox2 I need me some PIE!

    One thing these so called "pro life" people don't understand is overpopulation

    2-3k years ago it was fine to think that pro life was right because there were literally only 5-10 million humans

    Right now we have 7.5 billion humans and literally 3 billion have limited access to food or water so any idiot who are pro life want their children to live in a world with widespread starvation
     
  7. Anotherblackman

    Anotherblackman I need me some PIE!

    Comedy aside, George was a very very very intelligent comedian. I remember watching so much Bane Shift, and not just agreeing with him but disagreeing with him, but the way he was so eloquent with his timing is a master craft class of its own. He was free on that stage.
     
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  8. Ohmin

    Ohmin Forum Royalty

    Overall... "Pro-Choice" lawmakers want to force everyone to take vaccines in order to carry on with their lives... the problem isn't just hypocrisy (though there's plenty of that around), but it's also a matter of oversimplification of language.

    If someone is "Pro-Choice" that implies that they would be in favor of choices for all, but really it's just a misnomer for "Pro Abortion Legality" (and some even espouse forced aborthion, or sterilization to render people infirtile, such as Margeret Sanger, a renowned Eugenecist that helped push Pro-Choice and create what would become Planned Parenthood). Likewise, "Pro-Life" is a misnomer of it's own. "Pro-Life" really just means that one considers a fetus (at various stages, as there is no single set standard on this point yet), to be a "person" with all the rights and protections granted to a child that has already been born. One can think it reasonable to execute convicted murderers, and yet still have a "Pro-Life" position.

    Certainly I don't support this legislation from what I've been able to see of it, despite myself being "Pro-Life."

    But I understand it is easier and more convinient politically for "Pro-Choice" folks to embrace the oversimplification and attack the then apparent hypocrisy.


    The issue isn't overpopulation. It's logistics and economics. We have plenty of food production capacity to feed the world's current population and more.

    To me, it seems like you are cheering for death (at least of others) as a "solution" to problems, not just in this thread but in others. I must say I strongly disagree, and hope you will at least look for other possible ways to resolve problems. May you find them swiftly when you look.
     
  9. chickenpox2

    chickenpox2 I need me some PIE!

    And yet half the world population is starving while the production of food is rapidly deteriorating at the rate we are going we going to have 10 B by 2040 and only 1/3 is going to have access to food

    All I am saying is pro choice even if it can curb 10-20 million might help to stabilize food production as food technology improves in next 20 years it makes a huge difference
     
  10. IMAGIRL

    IMAGIRL Forum Royalty

    That's not entirely true and also assumes much about birth rates. You'll find that it's developed countries that have a high tendency towards neutral and even negative birth rates whilst developing countries will have excess birth rates. Now this isn't to say that there isn't people with limited access to food and water in developed countries, but I am saying that limiting birth rates in developed counties as a solution to such a problem will have an impact that is marginal at best.
     
    Ohmin likes this.
  11. Sokolov

    Sokolov The One True Cactuar Octopi

    My problem with pro-life politicians and legislation is that they almost always only attempt to PUNISH abortion, rather than reduce it.

    In other words, the point doesn't appear to be to save babies from abortion (because if it were, then your goal would be to minimize the # of abortions through any means, instead of only through things that punish people).

    In fact, pro-life politicians often even goes so far as to also support legislation that increases the theoretical demand for abortions via things like "abstinence-only sex ed" which increases the rate of teenage pregnancies.

    When talking to pro-life individuals, I have found the actual crux of the issue is often actually wanting to punish women for having sex without wanting babies. Of course, they are often also against ************, pornography and other non-intercourse methods of sexual release, so... yea.
     
  12. Bushido

    Bushido Devotee of the Blood Owl

    We need more abortions imo, but we also need more death penalties, so I don't know where I stand on this issue.
     
  13. Vash Dragneel

    Vash Dragneel I need me some PIE!

    The problem with the death penalty, is some people are found innocent years, and years after the crime was committed and they were wrongly found guilty. Killing an innocent man would be wrong.
     
  14. Bushido

    Bushido Devotee of the Blood Owl

    That's a problem with the courts not the punishment
     
  15. BurnPyro

    BurnPyro Forum Royalty

    cant have one without the other
     
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  16. Bushido

    Bushido Devotee of the Blood Owl

    Not true, CHAZ acted as judge jury and executioner.
     
  17. profhulk

    profhulk Forum Royalty

    Hmm. Don't kill your babies? Murder is bad? No sucky sucky no baby killy.
     
  18. Ohmin

    Ohmin Forum Royalty

    I think a lot of that has to do with how government is used in general.

    "Black people are dying from ODs and getting into more crime because of drugs!" The solution promoted by Biden and Thrumond? "Punish them more for their drug use! Thatll stop 'em!"

    Of course, part of this is that legislation itself is bent towards limiting human action in one way or another, in most cases. Most laws that exist exist to prohibit and/or punish specific behavior. You have a law against murder, but that doesn't mean murder won't happen. There is an argument of "deterrence" which is to say that someone is less likely to murder someone (intentionally anyway) if they fear the legal consequences. That has some measurable effect to be sure, but it is still rooted in "fear."

    Today, we have, not even laws, but decrees mandating people wear masks (even in defiance of medical experts findings on the matter, both current and over the last century or so of science on the matter), with fines, fees, and penalties for those that violate such decrees. Likewise for operating certain businesses in many parts of the world.

    To an extent, there is some middle ground being done with vaccines. NYC's mayor for example tauting "free fries" at a fastfood chain, or I've heard rumors of a sort of vaccine lottery where some handful of people will be given a million dollars out of all those that vaccinated.

    Yet at the same time there is still that urge to "punish" those that don't do what others want. "Take the vaccine or wear the mask forever" for example. Airlines that refuse passangers unless they can prove they've taken some specific medication (despite HIPA laws and similar around the world).


    Trying to punish a woman for wanting an abortion... with out looking at other avenues to help them first... can be cruel. Yet whether it is more or less cruel to let them kill their own child?

    Murder being punished by law is still a good thing. Indeed, encouraging people to think about the consequnces of their actions is a good thing... But in the long run, it is not "fear" "fear" "fear!" that will get the best results. Fear of punishment has never worked as a long-term deterrent to evil acts, and never stops those that do so on impulse, or driven by a greater fear. On the other hand, "love" can push out fear and hatred and other impulses, and override it for the sake of love.


    As the Bible says: "Fear of God is the beginning of Wisdom." But it also says that it is JUST the beginning, not the end or be-all of Wisdom. God would much rather people Love Him than Fear Him. Rather that people embrace doing Good for love of Good instead of merely fear being punished for Evil. But that doesn't mean there will be no punishment for Evil. Actions have consequences, but rather than merely fearing consequence of action... understanding, love, and hope should be fostered.


    When people look to government as a source for all the answers... this sort of thing happens, where one side, the carrot (subsidies and wellfare) or the stick (taxes, imprisonment, etc.), is used, and it's more often the stick because that's one of the things government has been geared to use most efficiently.

    If people want people to do good things, they need to promote doing good things, encourage people to choose of their own volition what is right. Not merely try to manipulate them with fear.


    Explain to people the consequences of their actions on all spectrums.
    If it's increasing the rate, it's obviously not doing it right. But proper education would still have a better effect overall. Unfortunately, most educational programs (it seems to me) are more about indoctrination and dogma, rather than actually encouraging learning and thinking and being invested in choices made. It's generally: "Beleive this and behave this way or else!"

    It doesn't help that academia has seemed to embrace a post-modern viewpoint when it comes to what is "true" let alone morality. But that's an issue for a different day.
     
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  19. Ohmin

    Ohmin Forum Royalty

    On a completely different but highly related note:

    A rhetorical question. Why is it always: "**** and/or incest" as the exception?

    Surely in most cases one thinks of incest as involving (at least statutory) ****. A family member molesting/raping another, or a seduction of an under-age person by an adult that should know better, etc. Yet surely that would therefore already be included in the "in case of ****" part of the exception? And the "in case of ****" is referring to the inability of a woman to have chosen to have/risk the pregnancy in the first place.

    So, thusly, the "or incest" part of the exception MUST imply consensual relations between adults (whom are closely related). If the option to choose or not choose to have an abortion is a "good" thing on the Pro-Choice side of things, why do they argue that incestuous relations should be granted extra "privileges"? And on the Pro-Life side of things, why should the child of an incestuous relationship be subject to fewer protections than one of another couple, let alone compound one "sin" on top of another for that couple itself?

    As I said, a rhetorical question, but the answer speaks to the heart of the problem with abortion and how many people view life itself.
     
    IMAGIRL likes this.
  20. Bushido

    Bushido Devotee of the Blood Owl

    The only colors are red white and blue
     

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