This attitude, right here, is what motivates most of my suggestions. The reason she was auto was not because she was the bestest ever, but because the theme which she belonged to was already fairly thin. When a theme lacks something in particular, any champion added to the theme that can fill the void becomes auto. The solution is not to strip auto champs down to nothing (making them 2x auto for the shoebox), but to take other runes currently in the shoebox and tie them to various themes in slightly overlapping roles. Suddenly players gain alternatives to champions they might not want to use in the first place (because they feel forced to). For example, look at this list I recently compiled of UD champs with poorly utilized upgrade paths. From that list, each of the following Bok (save Bok Mistress with just Bleed) lack any connection to Bleed or Life Siphon: Bok Enforcer (Battlemaster 1/2/3) Bok Gatekeeper (Defender of Chaos 1/2) Bok Guardian (Block 1/2 | Riposte 1/2/3) Bok Mistress (Charm 1/2/3) Bok Raider (Flamestrike 1/2/3 | Resistance: Fire 2/3) Adding a sprinkling of Bleed synergy to each is a great way to provide alternatives to the current autos of the Bleed theme. I actually liked that you moved part of my suggestion over to Bok Mistress (ignoring your disappointing first upgrade path), but dropping Bleed synergy from Hekatian Bloodguard simply swaps which one is 2x auto.
Expression of resentment towards something is equivalent to an "I'm unqualified to deal with this!" signpost as far as I'm concerned. I'm grateful and respect that you admit to it, I just wish you could also see that your feelings are completely clouding your judgement.
There will generally always be "2x auto" in the meta, regardless of how much things are balanced on paper whether it be for valid reasons, or just fads. IMO the Hekations in general were defined by 1-2 range, flying, bleed/blood related. She just happened to have a utility ability and a pet, which was something other bleed champions lacked, who were purely beaters. She also healed other champs, which is something UD sorely lacks. That utility did make her the center of Hekation BGs, no doubt about it. But... Now her damage is so low at range 1 that she can't even be called a beater. Blood Dispersal was actually an ability that I liked - conditional mass healing lowered by each champ it affected. I don't think that the amounts were too low to make a difference - 8 HP per hit if its just her. Now if you choose to go the utility route with her, she can't even proc her own Blood Dispersal because she doesn't have bleed. She depends on damage and hits to heal, but has low damage and low survivability. 1-2 range used to let her get around the melee by not having to engage. As with the others, i don't think anyone here is arguing to make any rune 2x autoinclude on purpose, or super powerful moreso than other runes. But she is torn too many directions, and her stats don't match her intended purpose to be playable. Her past history before a revamp should have 0 effect on that.
My proposal for bloodguard (still in progress) Hekatian bloodguard No pet. Just zoom her in without the pet, do some photoshop and she's ready to kick ass. "The support of the hekatian order does not come free, grimlic. Blood is our price." 92/7/6/1-1/1/40 Base: attack magical, blood dispersal (+12), flight (+6), pet: screaming imp (+35) Path1: drive (+5), ivigorate (+5), bleed (+6) Path2: drain (+2/4) Without abilities (only basic attack): 92-12-6-35-5-2=32 Changes: 74~76/7/6/1-3/1/44 (+3) Base: attack magical, blood dispersal (+12), flight (+6), aerial supremancy (+7) Path1: pull (+10), blood for nora (+9) Path2: bleed (+6), drive (+5), designate scapegoat (+5) 32+3+12+6+7+10+6=76 32+3+12+6+7+9+5=74
We won't bro. We're perfectly happy with your attempt to turn a common rune into her. Wow...I just found this thread and I must say I am freakin appalled. You should be yanked from this farce of a council IMMEDIATELY. Your wanting to buff/nerf runes because they are hard to get or because they enabled themes is disturbing. This right here pisses me off. The EXACT reason why I am NOT playing, making videos, or supporting this game. The Bloodguard WAS a cool and fun rune. Allowed bleed groups to exist and enabled them very well. Now, she is crap, will always be crap and will never see play because you simply don't like her!? Lame man....lame. Good freakin day.
I think you missed the point and the original discussions. Bloodguard was very popular and maybe for this reason half of the buff proposals in the UD forums involve her. She is still very hard to get. Because of the imp, bloodguard on het own will never be very good. I think taking the other distinctive ability from Bloodguard and passing it to other runes is good as we at least get to play with that ability without the huge imp sandbag. I think the more important question or remark is: why were so little proposed changes for UD implemented?
WHATS WRONG WITH A RUNE THAT CAN ACTUALLY DO MORE THAN ONE THING? Freaking A. In League of Legends there are certainly champs that can cross over from their designed "path" and do other roles. Why can't you have a Bloodguard that does multiple things? She was auto include because she was freaking cool and could do some cool things. She hardly broke the meta and UD was FAR from owning the meta. So now she will be "whatever the hell role I want to make her because it hurt my feelings she was hard to get and did more than one thing." Piss on that. The imp is a sandbag? If it were so useless why has it been nerfed a 100 times? The imp actually forces people to play differently around chasms and other areas because of its pushback and presence. She was good before the revamp, why do you think so many played her? Oh and remember this...the imp suks with her because it has been nerfed a 100 times. She has been nerfed 100 times. Can't wait to see what fun role she will be thrown into. Certainly won't be bleed will it although her name actually suggests that she should have something to do with bleed. But lore is just fluff...nevermind. We certainly don't want to be creative like MTG and have our cards/runes relate to their lore. Also, being hard to get shouldn't force a rune into retirement or change her role. Rune accessibility is not the runes fault, its the designers. If a rune is hard to get then there is a problem with the GAME not the rune. Get off that.
I put together a patch, make some cool themes playable, buff some fun shoebox stuff, tone down but not shoebox some OP things.... and all people want to talk about is the fuucking bloodguard. This is going to be my absolute last post on this subject: So some seriously selective memory going on. Bloodguard WAS dominating the meta. Anyone who was lucky enough to have them, ran them, in pretty much any theme - people ran it in spiders ffs. Sure it was a fun champ, but it's dumb to think this is the reason it was popular - it was popular because it was OP. All that said, I have a planned build for the bloodguard which i have thought about a lot, and think will make most people happy while avoiding the biggest problems. I am not willing to discuss it because I am sick to death of talking about it and think I've heard all the arguments at this stage. Not to mention that getting cretinous and insulting nerd rage doesn't exactly brighten my day after I've spent god knows how many hours herding cats in the pcr forums. It particularly annoys me because despite not liking it, I have spent more time on this champ than any other, so to be attacked for only buffing my favourites is completely misplaced. If you all hate my design you will have an opportunity to vote in another rep who will revert it to it's overpowered old self. So I will not respond to anything regarding bloodguard from now on. Good day to you too.
So when somebody comes with a suggestion in to save the rune it's not good? And when "somebody" suggests to make Bok Mistress the new bloodguard it's good? From what I've seen and experienced, 1. it's cool and all that Mistress has all these abilities, but it feels like the abilities are just mashed on to her in order/probebly to make something else of Bloodguard. From the past forums I get the idea that some people want her to be more imp related or something. 2. rare abilites on a common rune? What's the point of having legendary runes then? Why not give the pets aswell? The reason these discussions keep coming back is that people are not happy. Ding ding that's a signal that should trigger something immediately in your brain. I know whinning won't help, but atleast consider checking proposals, and in what kind of role(s) she could work better in. I sure everyone has seen the patches, and UD having the least changes. But that's ok, I won't whine about. I just trying to figure out whats wrong with the UD community here. There have been lots of suggestions from what I see in previous topics, but the implementation is minimal. What's up with that?
Ive always thought of the synergy between imps and demon worshippers/lesser demons (often depicted as corrupted elves or similar) being quite cool and thought it would be interesting if you had maybe a sub-theme within imps that could maybe lift the imp theme at the same time? Im mentioning this because when they released bloodguard and saw she had a pet imp and drive, I figured yes that would be awesome. But because it was SOE era, I knew she would be broken with alot of abilities she didnt need so that people HAD to have her. We are no longer in that era and im glad for it, as im sure alot of people stand with me on. Why not make her a sort of imp matriarch with guarded: imp. Let her have the pet, but remove blood dispersal and give her summon imp 1 as well. Now she has a key role in a new theme that hasnt been dusted off for a long time. Just my two cents.
You guys act like badger doesn't read the UD forums at all the way you whine about how he didn't implement your shitty proposals. Honestly, badger is one of the best council members currently, and if you can't see that, then you guys must either be blind or morons.
This is 100% the case. I heavily support the purefire patch for example. This rune in particular did get undue treatment from him, for silly reasons. That's all. What I surmise escaped him is that the conversation completely shifted away from Bloodguard alone to his temperament and treatment of runes as a whole, that's why this garnered such a passionate reaction. The pervading fear is that UD will be reduced to "What badgerdale likes" + a bunch of shoebox runes.
Bloodguard was one of my favs too , but i totally get where badge is coming from , and that's fine. The meta moves forward not backwards anyway BADGE IS DA MAN
You know. badge would be ALOT cooler if he got paingel got something like, I dunna. Loss of life? Magical Attack? just me? ok..
Lol. For anyone wondering, Bloodguard really was that good for basically all of its lifetime. Stupidly broken good. The main reason I was unable to play UD was because I didn't own 2. When I finally borrowed some it was just dumb. It can be a mid-tier Bok... if we're so concerned about the Bok theme, why can't we shift the power among some of the lower rarity runes? I see no particular reason for Bloodguard specifically to be a good rune other than it was indeed a big investment for people to acquire in the past.
Now that bok misstress has Blood dispersal, to me its kinda: Bok Misstress > Hekatian Bloodguard. How can it be: Common > Legendary. Thats stupid.
