I mean, when it's good it's too good and when it's bad it's really bad. From my perspective, there are several fundamental problems with ANY iteration of a champ-refund-based FF bonus: It's always just gonna be an overly complicated FS bonus. Either you're deploying enough champs to make it worth it or you're not. Usually this leads to... Snowballing, one way or the other. When the bonus was higher upfront, this meant you could easily snowball champs by chain deploying and sending in a constant stream of efficient beaters. The core problem here is that if you're ahead, your bonus puts you farther ahead, while if you're behind, it's not much help in getting you back in the game. Both of these situations make the game less fun, for one player or the other. No other faction bonus relies on you spending nora to reap its benefits. No faction bonus should rely on you spending nora to reap its benefits. It penalizes playing anything other than champs. The feeling of "losing" potential nora when playing spells, relics and equips isn't fun, and while champions are what the game revolves around, alternate play styles are suppressed by this limitation. It's really hard to calculate how much nora you're going to have. Especially with the on-death nora refund change, planning precise plays becomes needlessly complicated. Now, I'm not saying I have a fix in mind, but it's pretty clear, to me at least, that the bonus is going to continue to be a problem. If we have the opportunity now, while we're simplifying the game, why don't we at least take a look at the bonus? If it stays the same, I can live with that, just putting my opinion out there.
At least it's somewhat nearer to balanced than it used to be. FS bonus used to be 10 nora, and SP was 12% nora on deploy. SP had to deploy 84 nora a turn on champs in order to keep up. It was cruel.
And now when its better, ppl rage on without thinking that the problem with "you don't feel the reward of playing SP when you play spells etc relics".... its not like we get Nora EVERY TURN by not doing anything. We only do so by playing actively, deploying and dying deploying and dying. and when you play spells, you're not even gonna get anything in return. now how about we talk about ST getting all sorts of bonuses just bcoz their skin is white and they live on white soil... I mean... a free banner???? (+5 HP) oh wait FF.. TWO free banners?!?! (+10HP)
Isn't it the same with most other factions? Unless you think KF spells can get +1 SPD, or UD equips get +4 dmg. Analogically, Most faction bonuses actually relies on you spending nora to reap its benefits, since you need to deploy champions (and therefore use nora) to get KF speed or UD Damage, for instance. The more champions you deploy, the more you benefit from them, its the same witth SP.
I would complety erradicate bonuses... The game is already too complicated to balance toward 8 faction to even care about special bonuses per each and splits.
Yeah, I remember that. It was pretty ridiculous. FS also had some of the most efficient champs in the game for a while. I guess it just goes to show that the game has always been imbalanced, just in different ways. I see your point. Sorry I didn't make it clear in my post. In my mind I was still comparing bonuses between FS and SP.
I see. Then, FS is the Faction bonus here which is not in line with the others, not SP, because instead of benefit the player for deploying champions, it benefits the player depending on turns passed. Still, the more turns passed, the more champions you will probably have in play, so FS isn't actually that different from the others either. Even if they change some, they will still be as hard to balance as it is now, and removing them takes away the pleasure of playing a faction more than others. I think they are fine.
ProR2DR summed up my thoughts. You haven't made any valid argument so far as to why it should change, apart from it being too complicated for nora calculation purposes. I don't think it's in need of a change atm, unless all the faction bonuses are being remade aswell.
