worries about the big change

Multiple stacking debuffs upon hit, multiple forms of mobility and relocate, multiple forms of lockdown, many different forms of stealth... ferren are prime offenders when looking at a) complexity creep and b) "always run this champ and always deploy it" ... don't get me wrong, Coragh, Enforcer, Augur are also prime offenders, as are a couple of the minotaurs and several of the crazier "super-champs" out there... but get off your high horse about Ferren.

 

I am sorry Ferren are the poster child of what is wrong with pox.

Ferren focus is already completely ridiculous as a racial. (-1 speed, def and dmg) for getting hit by 1 attack. 50% less dmg for getting hit by 2. Stunned after that.

Then lets give them swap, hidden arctic, dodge, escape, hit and run, forage... I mean what?

 

you do realize that this is core idea of ferren to be as mobile as possible? that swaping and locking is the objective?
and as i said no one ferren can lock you out
yes you can use ancient implication on master and have one punch stun but that is combo and you need to cast spell or have some1 to put majestic
but that's team work
its not op at all you need to plan ahead twice as much for it to rly work
not to mention non of the ferren have majestic on its own and stun is broken doesint show if target is stuned 1 or 2 and that is one important knowledge

and my high horses arent about ferren
but about puting one champion wich is op as Firk vs whole theme
ferren arent op ferren = synergy
havent you noticed how rarerly people play ferren becouse its complicated to play like that

enforcer isint you just poke or block with masive def not to mention if put in if spli + hammerheart on it omfg
corgath isint you just barf on everything once or twice nad rush font
augur push into traps or abyss chasm

this is riddiculus

 

No PharumM it's ALL offensive... and I hope it all gets the kick in the teeth that it deserves to make this game fun again.

 

All I can say is if the overhaul doesn't result in bucket loads of tears, they are doing it wrong. Like cutting out a bullet, it's going to hurt. A lot.

But I am convinced that ultimately everyone will realise that going back to basics does indeed create more depth in gameplay and that it makes the game more interesting for everybody, from newbie to veteran.

Regarding your Bowmage example... It's funny that you say that removing Blindfire and Evasive 2 would put him in the shoebox for you. The only reason you would put a champ like that in the show box is that such abilities are required now to keep up with the power creep. There used to be a time when Varu Howler wasn't just runnable, but one of the most efficient champs in the game. And he didn't even have that weird Ichor ability.

The game also had many issues back then (FW attrition, first turn initiative wins, and turtling maps come to mind), but the complexity creep is something else entirely and in no way required to solve any of those issues.

 

I mean somebody explain to me the difference between elusive and arrow eater and why we need both.

I will then use your explanation as an example of how this has become too complex.

 

Elusive is "no hit, unless stunned or paralyzed" while Arrow Eater is "no damage, add 50% damage to attacks" ... both related to ranged. So LOL will trigger on an arrow eater, but not on an elusive.

 

And Precision hits Elusive, but not Arrow Eater. /wink wink

 

Yup sounds complicated if what you really meant to say was "Don't attack this champ with range"

 

Not that I support the many different abilities that do almost the same thing... but Elusive champs CAN still get attacked by precisions champs or equipments like Murder. Arrow Eater is the real hard counter to range as they cannot get hit whatsoever. The idea I suppose was to make certain champs a bit more survivable through Elusive, but not completely immune to range attacks, like Arrow Eater champs. Though in all honesty, they could easily do away with Elusive and give said champs Absorb or something.

There's many stuff like this. Lot of different abilities that damn near do the same thing. I agree it's ridiculous.

 

we needed elusive to sell new runes because making more runes with arrow eater apparently wouldn't sell as well. this complexity reset is all well and good. but the reason for it still remains. just saying.

 

fanboys are ruinning poxnora

 

Except under certain conditions (Precision > Elusive, LoL > Arrow Eater)

 

hell yeah. esp. that ridiculous barb racial. most complicated Bane Shift in the game right there

 

It looks like some of you don't understand how the change will affect the game.

If they remove 2-3 abilities from the current ferren, then match against the current Coragh, obviously it will be an unfair battle. Point is, they are planning to remove abilities from the current coragh too. They are not intended to be nerfed in the sense of putting below the power curve when compared to the rest of the runes, the idea is to remove complexity all across the game, lowering the power curve as a whole, hence, a ferren vs zombies after the revamp will be as hard as before the revamp.

But, it will take less time to learn and understand what the freak is going on every turn. It will be less complex. Are you afraid of the devs shoeboxing your favourite rune? Suck it up, peach. They will nerf mine too, and his favourite rune too, and everybody's favourite. Why "my", or "your", or "her" rune deserves any special treatment? If removing the DE Masochist from the meta will keep the game alive and improve the game as a whole... it sucks, yet still, it must be done what must be done.

My biggest fear? At one hand I am sure there will be such massive crying on the forums once the revamp goes live, I am afraid the developers may attempt to step back, and break the entire purpose of the change. Just like that developer: revamp the game, simplify the champions (getting ride of the whole cp system) and create a new meta. So far, so good. Then on the next expansion it released such massive powercreeped champions the revamp becomes irrelevant. And things goes down hill from there.

If I have any other fear is the owls may not put the right attention to some of the biggest culprits. Yeah, you are thinking on Snogvie, unholy tomb, momma bear, and so on. I'm thinking on specific abilities. Cones, breaths and bombs; teleport, tunnel and (to a lesser degree), leap; acolyte and several global abilities, like pain curse. Heck, ping was universally hated, yet it still around here. Do we actually need 3 ranks of said ability? Do we need the ping version on the stitched dreameater? Do we need it to be on a split hero with an equipment that grant perseverance? BTW, do the hero equipment need the refund clause?

But, hey, we can not apply the UD or IS or FK label to any of those abilities (because they are on many champions across many factions), so who cares? Nerf the FotM champion first.

 

i did just respond to what RedDain said was his idea of uncomplexifying things that i didint like
my true worrries is that revamp will take huge amount of time not literarly implementation just the aftershock
bugs
glitches
server unstability
silly things like when you stelth champion xD he doesint realy stelth and enemy can see it now that was fun bug
many more

 

- This still hurts me.... guild wars 1...so epic, so full of customization. Guild wars 2.. "im holding a dagger...thank god..now I know spells" -_-

 

considering the reaction here, I doubt they will do anything dramatical. I just changed my mind. too many players would freak out seeing their rune being nerfed even if that's a part of big process. I already imagine all those threads asking why X was nerfed during revamp...

 

People don't seem to understand the purpose of a revamp. It isn't to nerf anything, kill customization or ruin depth/strategy. They want to undo years of powercreep that have pushed the game into a state of very little strategy and a large amount of crutching on broken runes. Simplifying champions into specific unique roles doesn't do anything to harm the depth and strategy that brought everyone to this game. If anything it should improve it because you have to actually plan your deck out rather then just tossing the same 12 champs that every other player in the game is running in their deck.

 

Makes me wonder what new abilities the new champs will have and how they will try to limit new abilities on new champions this will be the true task.